The Strategy Behind the Story: PR, Social, and Influencer Marketing with Nikki Dindo

by Glynis Tao | Jul 2, 2025 | Podcast

In this episode, we chat with Nikki Dindo, founder of Spring Media Co., a boutique agency specializing in social media management, influencer marketing, and media relations. Nikki shares her journey through the fashion and PR industry, emphasizing the importance of authenticity, storytelling, and strategic branding. She discusses her experiences working with notable figures in PR and her approach to launching Spring Media Co. The conversation covers common mistakes in social media and PR, the process of developing a social media strategy, and actionable advice for fashion entrepreneurs.

About Nikki Dindo

With over a decade of experience leading digital strategy in both Vancouver and New York City, Nikki Dindo is a powerhouse in the world of PR, social media, influencer marketing, and event production. As the founder of Spring Media Co., she and her team helps brands show up with confidence, clarity, and creative impact online and off. From managing influencer campaigns for global brands to producing shows at New York Fashion Week, Nikki brings big picture thinking and hands-on experience to everything she does. She's also worked with luxury clients like Park Hyatt and built authentic connections that go far beyond algorithms. When she's not supporting founders and creators through her agency work, Nikki shares her expertise as a social media instructor at Blanche MacDonald, mentoring the next generation of digital talent.

Whether she's consulting from her hometown in Vancouver or creating content from a coffee shop in New York City, Nikki's all about empowering people to tell their stories well and build a brand that actually feels like them.

Contact info

Website: https://www.springmediaco.com/

Instagram: @nikkidindo

Takeaways

• Define your brand voice and visuals before posting.
• Focus on quality over quantity when choosing social platforms.
• Posting without a plan leads to off-brand content and burnout.
• Authentic storytelling builds stronger customer trust.
• Don’t chase trends that don’t align with your brand values.
• Select influencers based on audience alignment, not just reach.
• Long-term partnerships perform better than one-off posts.
• Track engagement that signals real connection—not just likes.
• Short-form video is a powerful, low-cost way to grow.
• Showing your face and sharing your story creates a deeper impact.

Interview themes

What are the biggest mistakes fashion brands make with social media?

Fashion brands often fall into the trap of doing more instead of doing better. Nikki Dindo highlights that many are spreading themselves too thin—trying to be on every platform, chasing trends that don’t fit, and outsourcing content before they've clarified their brand voice.

One of the most common mistakes is posting without a clear plan or strategy, which leads to inconsistent messaging and off-brand visuals. Others focus too much on vanity metrics like likes and follower counts, rather than measuring deeper engagement like shares, saves, DMs, and click-throughs. Influencer marketing is also often mishandled—brands choose influencers based on follower count instead of audience alignment or values fit, and rely on one-off posts instead of building meaningful, long-term partnerships. Most critically, many brands are afraid to show their human side. In a space where authenticity matters, hiding behind curated grids and avoiding founder-led storytelling makes it harder to build connection and trust.

What first steps should fashion brands take before posting to multiple platforms?

Many founders think they need to post more or be on every platform to succeed—but Nikki says that’s backwards. Before you start creating content or hiring help, you need to get clear on your brand’s voice, values, and audience. Without that foundation, nothing you post will stick. She advises fashion entrepreneurs to define their core messaging and brand visuals first, then build a system around it that allows for consistency without burnout.

How can agencies work with brands to create sustainable social strategies that actually work?

Nikki’s approach to social media strategy starts with listening—not posting. She begins every client relationship by doing a deep dive into the brand’s goals, challenges, and audience, followed by a full audit of current performance. From there, she builds a plan around strategic content pillars, brand voice alignment, and a calendar system the founder can actually keep up with. It’s not about posting more—it’s about posting with intention.

What are fashion entrepreneurs getting wrong about influencer marketing?

Too many brands chase vanity metrics or send out products without a clear plan. Nikki emphasizes the importance of selecting influencers whose audience actually matches your target market—and creating partnerships that feel long-term and values-aligned. She stresses the need for clear contracts, expectations, and approval processes so both the brand and the creator are set up for success. One post won’t cut it. Connection and consistency matter more.

How can I brand measure campaign success beyond likes and reach?

In 2025, Nikki encourages brands to track “resonance metrics” like saves, shares, DMs, and time on site. These indicators show that your content is making people pause, reflect, and act—not just scroll. She also looks for qualitative wins: customer feedback, press mentions, and partnership inquiries sparked by visibility. For Nikki, the best outcome is when a founder says: “I finally feel proud of how we’re showing up online.”

Where should fashion brands focus on when they have small marketing budgets?

If you’re in the early stages and resources are tight, Nikki’s advice is clear: invest in brand story and visuals first. Once you have that solid foundation, prioritize organic content—especially short-form video like reels or stories. It’s still one of the most effective free ways to build trust and get discovered. Then, consider partnerships with micro-influencers, like-minded brands, or a freelance strategist to help you stay consistent.

Why is showing your face oftentimes more powerful than paid ads?

Nikki sees it time and time again: one authentic, founder-led video outperforms a dozen polished posts. Her biggest advice? Stop hiding behind your grid. Fashion is personal—and people want to know why you started, how you design, and what you believe. When brands lead with heart and personality, they create emotional connections that build loyal communities—not just one-time customers.

Chapters

00:00 The Heart of Branding and Creativity

01:47 Nikki Dindo: A Journey Through Fashion and PR

05:56 Launching Spring Media Co.: A New Approach to PR

09:36 Lessons from Kelly Cutrone: Intensity and Clarity

13:36 Common Mistakes in Social Media and PR

17:30 Developing a Social Media Strategy: The Process

21:27 The Importance of Authenticity in Influencer Marketing

25:27 Case Study: Skip Hop Campaign Success

29:15 Finding the Right Influencers for Your Brand

33:03 Actionable Advice for Fashion Entrepreneurs

37:10 The Creative Influence of New York and Broadway

Transcript

Nikki Dindo

I get really lit up by brands and creatives with a strong point of view. Even if it's still messy or evolving, I just love it when there's heart and intention behind what someone is building and they just need a little bit of help bringing it to life in like a more refined and strategic way. So whether that's like fashion founders creating pieces with real meaning or a wellness brand that's actually grounded in science and care or a travel company that's telling stories that most people overlook or, you know, sharing destinations that are off the grid and more people need to know about.

But I'm especially drawn to people who have just really cared deeply about what they do, but maybe they just don't always know how to communicate that in a way that resonates online. And at the end of the day, I love working with good people, you know, cool people who's mission and values I stand behind and I just want to kind of help amplify that. And I also love working with founders and creatives who are just willing to be a little bit brave.

Glynis Tao

Welcome to Chase Your Dreams, a podcast for fashion entrepreneurs who want to build a purposeful and profitable clothing business so they can make a living doing what they love. I'm your host, Glynnis Tao, an apparel business consultant and SEO specialist with 20 years apparel industry experience. I'm also a mom to a wonderfully energetic little boy named Chase.

With over a decade of experience leading digital strategy in both Vancouver and New York City, Nikki Dindo is a powerhouse in the world of PR, social media, influencer marketing, and event production. She's the founder of Spring Media Co., a boutique agency that helps brands show up with confidence, clarity, and creative impact online and off. From managing influencer campaigns for global brands to producing shows at New York Fashion Week, Nikki brings big picture thinking and hands-on experience to everything she does. She's also worked with luxury clients like Park Hyatt and built authentic connections that go far beyond algorithms. When she's not supporting founders and creators through her agency work, Nikki shares her expertise as a social media instructor at Blanche McDonald, mentoring the next generation of digital talent.

Whether she's consulting from her hometown in Vancouver or creating content from a coffee shop in New York City, Nikki's all about empowering people to tell their stories well and build a brand that actually feels like them.

Welcome, Nikki. It's so nice to have you here today. Thanks for joining me on the podcast.

Nikki Dindo

Thank so much. So good to be here.

Glynis Tao

So you've built an amazing career in both Vancouver and New York City, leading digital strategy for brands across various industries. Can you take us back to the moment when you realized this was the path you wanted to pursue?

Nikki Dindo

My goodness, it was actually a complete accident. I worked in marketing. I went to university for marketing and I was a business major and thought I was going to go to law school though. And instead of doing that, went and worked on board a cruise ship for five years and came back and was a little bit lost and not entirely sure of where I wanted to go and what I want to do next.

And after kind of experimenting with a few different career options, I wound up going back to school for fashion marketing. And I actually intended to be a buyer. I thought maybe I wanted to have my own store. At the time I was seeing a lot of gaps in the retail strategy and the retail market in Vancouver and thought that that's what I wanted to do. But within my first month of being back in school, I got coached by our career counselor and executive team there. And they said, hey, we think you'd be a really good fit in the PR industry and they kind of placed me in a few different work opportunities and got my feet wet and I realized very quickly that they were right. And so I started my career in fashion PR and then very quickly pivoted over to social media marketing.

Glynis Tao

Do you specialize in any particular industry or niche? What drew you to fashion and lifestyle brands specifically?

Nikki Dindo

Yeah, so I specialize in consumer facing brands in the lifestyle space. So everything from fashion and beauty to baby and kids, travel and tourism, kind of anything that fits within that lifestyle space. I've also done lots of celeb brands, film and TV. So all over the map, but I did get my career start in fashion.

Glynis Tao

Okay, because you said you went to school for fashion marketing. Is that sort of the reason why you decided to also stay with fashion and working with fashion brands?

Nikki Dindo

And so immediately after I finished school, I moved to New York City and got an internship working for Kelly Cutrone. And I was producing runway shows for New York Fashion Week, which like as a girl who grew up on magazine culture, like my goodness, I think I have had been subscribed to InStyle magazine since I was 10 or 11 and was constantly saving all my fashion magazines and making cutouts and collages. It was an absolute dream come true to have gone from seeing runway shows in my magazines and then being behind the scenes and producing them all those years later.

Glynis Tao

Okay, so I know you mentioned that you had worked with the legendary Kelly Cutrone and I really want to get the meat behind that. Like what really happened? What was it like?

But before we get to that, sort of like what inspired you to launch Spring Media Co. and how does your agency's approach differ from traditional PR or digital firms?

Nikki Dindo

Yeah, honestly, spring was kind of born out of a mix of instinct and necessity. I'd been doing social media and brand work for others long before I officially launched anything. I had close to a decade of agency experience. I'd help friends with their businesses, jump in on passion projects, and I found myself kind of constantly drawn to that intersection of storytelling strategy and design.

And the actual spark came while I was on vacation in Bali and was talking to all these amazing women around me. I just realized how many brilliant founders and creatives and brands had so much heart behind what they were doing, but their online presence just didn't really reflect that. And, you know, I just kind of kept thinking that there's a real opportunity here to help be able to work with female founders and amplify their voices. And, you know, I saw how much more impactful their stories could be if their online presence kind of matched the soul of their business.

So it was a little bit of a slow build after I kind of had that first aha moment. But then I reached a point where, you know, I just wanted to stop treating something that I did on the side and start treating it like the creative business it deserved to be. So eventually I took that leap and that's how Spring Media Co came to life.

Yeah. And then how is my approach different? I think that was the second part of that. One of the biggest things that as a company that we prioritize, especially when working with fashion founders, is clarity, sustainability, and support. So we know that founders and brands and startups are juggling absolutely everything. And our goal isn't to add more to anyone's plate. We want to take things off of it. So we truly pride ourselves on being an extension of your team. I always tell people when I first meet them that I want them to think of us as being one of them.

Nikki Dindo

You know, I want to be on their weekly calls. I want to know what is happening and feel like I am one of them rather than an external agency partner that they send things to. I want to preemptively know what they're working on so that instead of me going to them to ask for more details, I already know what they need and I've already given them ideas and brought them options for how to execute it. So, you know, we're not really here to just help you post and land a few press hits. We're really here to help you think bigger, show up more consistently and feel like your brand is telling the story that you actually want to tell.

Glynis Tao

Amazing. So I'm going to go more into your process a little bit later, but let's just go back to the topic of working with Kelly Cutrone. So she's legendary and definitely a name that needs no introduction in the PR and fashion world. What was your experience like and what did you learn from her that still guides your work today?

Nikki Dindo

Man, working for Kelly was one of those wild, formative experiences that will probably stick with me forever. As you can guess, she is extremely intense, but I would say that her intensity is in the kind of way that really pushes you to rise to the occasion. It was very much a sink or swim work environment, but if you swam you were given so much responsibility and such an incredible opportunity to learn. I was pretty young when I started working with her and it was truly like being thrown into the deep end, but that's where I learned the most. You know, she's a force and being in her orbit, especially during fashion week was like bootcamp for the fashion and PR world. While I was there, she was also creating a brand and filming two television shows. So I also got to see the back end of so much of the industry with her.

In my responsibilities, I was largely in charge of coordinating backstage access for the runway shows at Fashion Week. So that meant working with press, talent, stylists, makeup artists, and all internal and external teams to make sure that everything ran smoothly behind the scenes. It was very fast paced. It was high pressure and full of last minute changes, but I absolutely loved it. That experience really taught me how to stay calm under pressure. It taught me how to be a problem solver and how to trust my instincts and communicate very clearly even when everything was moving a mile a minute and falling apart around me.

Another thing I learned while I was working with Kelly is I mean something that she's absolutely brilliant at is cutting through the noise. She knows exactly what a brand stands for and never tries to be everything to everyone. And that's something that really helped me shape how I think about storytelling today especially in a world where people are constantly scrolling. It's more so that I've learned the importance of having to be clear, bold, and unapologetic about your message because she was not, she was sometimes controversial, but she made news and she knew how to get a message out there.

Glynis Tao

Wow, that sounds like a really amazing experience. How long were you with her?

Nikki Dindo

Yeah, just about a year and I ran two seasons of runway shows for her.

Glynis Tao

And so how long were you in New York for?

Nikki Dindo

I stayed in New York after working with Kelly and I was there for just under five years, then came back to Vancouver and spent another kind of five years in Vancouver and then had an opportunity to go back to New York again and was working as head of digital for a PR agency in New York right up until the pandemic actually.

Glynis Tao

Okay, so that's really recent.

Nikki Dindo

Quite recent. And then, you know, as kind of pandemic things happen. And I loved, loved, loved going back there. I loved the team I was working with, the brands we were working with, but I kind of started freelancing just a tiny bit before and knew that that's kind of where my calling was. And then as the pandemic happened, it almost forced my hand a little bit. You know, we had so much indecision and didn't really know what was going to happen in the industry. And I was back in Vancouver, just kind of waiting it out. And, you know, all of a sudden a lot of brands needed to be online and amplify their online presence very quickly. And so I just kind of kept taking on more work and then needing to bring people onto the team. That's how Spring Media kind of really came to be. It was ultimately a pandemic baby that had been in my head for quite some time, but that really brought it to life in a new way that surpassed even what I had been expecting to do.

Glynis Tao

Wow, that's a great story.

Nikki Dindo

I love New York. It still feels like home and I'm always happy to hop on a plane for a quick work trip or even a photo shoot.

Glynis Tao

Yeah I lived there briefly, not as long as you did, but it's definitely very different, I guess, the pace there compared to Vancouver.

Many founders are overwhelmed with doing all the things and struggle with getting media attention. What's one mistake you often see fashion entrepreneurs make when it comes to social media or PR and how can they fix it?

Nikki Dindo

Yes. One of the kinds of mistakes that I see the most is that people are trying to do everything and be everywhere all at once. And I get it. There are so many platforms and we're constantly being told that we need to be posting five times a day on this platform, but also be on this platform. And don't forget this new emerging one. You want to be, you know, at the start of it. And I don't think that's necessary. I think what is most important is to really listen to your audience, know who they are, know where they are, and just really focus on a couple of platforms. Otherwise, you're going to spread yourself too thin.

Even if you have a team, trying to be successful and keep up with every single platform is going to be exhausting. You're going to get burnt out. Other parts of your business will suffer if you are spending your entire day, especially as a fledgling brand, you're just starting out. You don't have time to be filming TikToks all day long. Is it fun? Sometimes for some people. So I think it's better to kind of really understand where your audience is and focus on strategically growing a couple of platforms, meet your audience where they are and go from there.

Glynis Tao

For early stage clothing brands, what are the must-haves before they're PR ready?

Nikki Dindo

I would say that you need to have a very solid understanding of your audience. So make sure that you've kind of gone through and done the research. I think you need strong branding. You need to know your messaging. You need to know what it's going to look like to show up as a successful brand online. So I think strong messaging and branding is super important.

Having a website, definitely you need to have that up and running so that you have somewhere to guide all that amazing traffic that's going to go flooding there. But I think that kind of having that beginning point of making sure that you have strong branding and a strong direction of where you want to go and who you want to reach is the most important. From there, you know, we can work on shaping out what that looks like, what the core pillars are going to be.

But you want to know what your foundation is and how your current visuals and messaging stack up against the competitors, because that's information that we'll use to help you stand out. Those will become our anchor points and we'll build the actual strategy around those pillars, really kind of balancing storytelling with conversation.

Glynis Tao

Can you share your process when you're developing a social media strategy for a new fashion client? And what do you look for in terms of the branding or visuals or storytelling? What is it that you look for?

Nikki Dindo

For sure. So whenever I start working with any new client, the first thing that we do is listen. We want to understand their vision, their values, what makes them different, where they want to go, not just what they sell. So we'll sit back and listen first and just learn as much as we possibly can about the brand. Social media isn't just about posting outfits. It's also about telling the deeper story behind the brand in a way that really resonates and builds trust over time. Now more so than ever.

So once we've kind of gotten that foundation, we'll dive in and do a full audit. We'll look at what's working, what's not, what's engaging. You know, as I mentioned before, kind of how we're stacking up against your competitors and really use that data to kind of help build out a full strategy. So once we have done the audit, we'll build out the strategy, look at core messaging and content pillars and really kind of use that as our North Star when it comes to developing content.

So we'll go through creating that strategic guide, make sure that everyone is aligned on it. We'll take our ideas, we'll do mocks, we'll put together sample posts, sample feeds, some kind of trial reels just so they can get an idea of our vision. We'll bring it to them. Then they'll also go through and it's a conversation. They'll tell us what they like, what they don't like, what doesn't feel aligned. And from there, we'll kind of get to work on creating the actual content.

So whether that is doing creative direction for shoots, whether that's leading with our own brand photography and videography, turning all of that into engaging content. We'll also kind of make sure that all of our ideas are doable for the team behind the scenes. We understand that not everyone can do everything. So we want to make sure that our plan is balanced and doable.

And so to help with things like that will also often create systems, templates, content calendars, approval workflows, just to kind of help make everything feel seamless. And again, make sure that we're really taking as much off of their plate as possible. As I kind of said, the biggest piece is like we approach everything like we're part of their team. We don't, you know, just deliver a strategy and disappear. We're there in the day to day helping refine, adapt as the brand grows or shifts. Also, you know, if there's an option, an opportunity to jump on a trend, but maybe we need to lean on someone. I'll kind of put together an email and say, hey, I think this would be such a good fit to tap into this. Can you spend 10 minutes? Do you know, film me like this, like that, like that. And just want to make sure that we always accommodate for anything, any opportunity to help their brand be part of that larger conversation. You know, especially in fashion where things are moving fast, that kind of flexibility and partnership truly makes all the difference.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, it sounds very collaborative too, the way that you work with your clients. Yeah, I guess taking that time upfront, to do the audit, to really understand their business and coming up with the strategy before you even do any posting and stuff like that. Cause I find a lot of times they just go and start posting. I don't know. I find it very frustrating because what they post doesn't necessarily really align with who I am as a business and my brand. I don't think they really understand it yet. So I think that's really important and it's great that you do that.

Nikki Dindo

I think it's so important to have those conversations upfront. That way it's just kind of crystal clear and also just constantly checking in on that because things change, focuses change. And I would rather always kind of have that conversation and that open communication as we go along just to make sure that we're always aligned.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, and also, guess doing those check-ins and having checkpoints in place with your clients and making sure that you are aligned in what you're doing so that there are no surprises and someone going, this is not really like they're not happy with it in the end and just like what, you know, like, but it was never really communicated.

Nikki Dindo

So many times. And so I'm all for monthly check-ins, even weekly check-ins and like cross department. That way there's just full visibility, open communication and no surprises because I think everyone has kind of been in that situation where one person maybe said yes or you got used to saying yes and then you just throw something up on social and then you get an email, you know, I didn't authorize this or like this is an old product. How did this go up there?

So it can sometimes feel tedious, especially in the beginning to kind of go through that approval process. But it's so important down the line, especially when it comes to messaging and just making sure that brand voice sounds like them. Because there's nothing more jarring than coming across a post that just feels off brand as a consumer.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, and it's hard to find an agency or somebody who actually gets it and this is kind of the thing that I hear often a lot from my clients is that they have to end up doing the social media themselves because they're just kind of like, no one's able to do it as well. I'm kind of feeling like, yeah, that's maybe a challenge for you to kind of be able to find that in between, I guess, between you and them, but really to be able to make it sound like, what you're saying is really sounding like them coming as if it's from them.

Nikki Dindo

Yeah, that's a big one. And it's I, and I get it. And especially if it comes to like a personal brand or a founder or something, because that's you, that's your voice. And sometimes people have a hard time articulating it too. You know, this doesn't sound like me, but I don't know how to say why. I think I like to pride our team on being able to capture brand and also personal brand voices very well and I tell them from the beginning I said please please please give me as much feedback give me as many notes edit this you're not going to hurt my feelings I would wrap the more information you give me the quicker I'll be able to learn and adapt and truly it usually just takes one max two rounds of feedback and edits and then we're pretty easy to nail it down and be able to just kind of absorb that voice and switch into it moving forward which, it seems odd. I think it's because I was a double major between English and business. I was always a huge reader, a huge writer. So I think it might have been that from before that it never felt too difficult for me to switch into voices and copywriting was actually always my favorite aspect of social. But thankfully being able to kind of translate that and help teach my team and share that skillset with them has been I think very valuable for everyone on the team that we've been able to kind of learn and adapt to different brand voices relatively with ease.

Glynis Tao

Brands or creatives light you up the most to work with.

Nikki Dindo

I get really lit up by brands and creatives with a strong point of view. Even if it's still messy or evolving, I just love it when there's heart and intention behind what someone is building and they just need a little bit of help bringing it to life in a more refined and strategic way. So whether that's fashion founders creating pieces with real meaning, or a wellness brand that's actually grounded in science and care, or a travel company that's telling stories that most people overlook or, you know, sharing destinations that are off the grid and more people need to know about. But I'm especially drawn to people who have just really cared deeply about what they do, but maybe they just don't always know how to communicate that in a way that resonates online. And at the end of the day, I love working with good people, you know, cool people who's mission and values I stand behind and I just want to kind of help amplify that. And I also love working with founders and creatives who are just willing to be a little bit brave. You know, the internet moves fast, but the brands that stick are the ones that know who they are and are willing to show up with honesty and creativity. And that kind of energy is just magnetic. And I gravitate towards those kinds of people. And I think that that's where as an agency, we do our best work as well.

Glynis Tao

Let's talk a little bit about influencer marketing. Influencer marketing changes fast. What makes a campaign successful in 2025 and how do you measure success beyond likes and reach?

Nikki Dindo

For sure, okay, so I think at the end of the day for influencer marketing or for campaigns in general, but especially for influencer marketing, it's really about authenticity. And I know that we hear that all the time, but it's true. Consumers now, especially with influencers, know and understand that influencers are getting paid for a lot of their partnerships. People know that, but I think that the most authentic influencers are still only going to take those partnerships that is from a brand that they would already buy from or a company that they would already use. And therefore it doesn't feel salesy. It feels authentic and it should kind of meld seamlessly into any non-sponsored content as well. And people will kind of still know that it's an affiliate link and they'll make some money off of it. But as long as it still feels true to the brand and that the influencers are still providing value, then I think that they know and are willing to help support them with something like that. So I think authenticity is extremely important, especially in the influencer space.

And then kind of social media in general in 2025, a successful campaign, I think goes way beyond likes and reach. Now those kind of used to be the prime metrics before. Nowadays, we kind of look at measuring things that are indicators of resonance and relationship. So the question that I'm kind of always asking is like, did this campaign actually move the needle? Did it create a moment? Did it have a deeper connection with the audience? So this could mean stronger brand loyalty, an increase in DMs, more website traffic, or even just people spending more time engaging with your content in more meaningful ways. So metrics that we look at now, and also the algorithm looks at, are kind of more in line with shares and saves because

Anybody can like something without putting much thought into it, but a share and a save is a better indicator that this is meaningful content that somebody wants to send to somebody else or wants to save to come back to for themselves. So, you know, it's a better indicator of like a cute comment or emojis, but knowing how many people saved your content really kind of is an indicator of whether a piece of content has any stickiness or whether something hit.

We also look at the backend data. So click through rates, email signups, time on site. And we take that to the clients. Sometimes too success looks like a product selling out and knowing that it came from social first push. Sometimes it's a new partnership or a press opportunity that came out of visibility. I'm working with a personality right now, let's say, and amplifying their personal brand online. And we are getting podcast requests and press requests all the time sent to us via DMs as a request of somebody seeing their content on Instagram first. So that's also kind of an indicator of success in a campaign that their visibility is kind of moving outside of Instagram and into the real world in other ways.

So other times it's opportunities coming out of visibility. And sometimes it's just, you know, a founder saying, we finally feel proud of how we're showing up online. So I think at the end of the day, looking at success for campaigns these days is a blend of data and instinct. If something feels sticky and it's getting shared, sparking conversations, that's a win.

Glynis Tao

Certainly is. Love it. You've worked on social campaigns with brands like Skip Hop. Could you share what went into building that campaign and the kind of results it delivered?

Nikki Dindo

Yes, absolutely. My gosh, working with Skip Hop was such a fun and rewarding project. I did this on the social side in conjunction with a PR agency that I was working with and was brought on as their social partner. So at the time, Skip Hop, when we first started Skip Hop was toying with the idea of an acquisition and they are wanting to improve their brand online kind of in advance of that. And in addition, they also wanted to reach modern parents in a way that felt both relatable and stylish because that was kind of new within the parenting space at the time. They didn't really want to be overly salesy or traditional. So we started by getting super, super clear on their audience, millennial parents, mainly millennial women who value design functionality and a bit of humor and amongst the chaos of parenting. So from there, we built a content strategy that leaned into an aspirational but attainable lifestyle. So think really elevated visuals, quick tips and like real parent moments that felt authentic.

In addition to this, we had a very, very, very strong influencer seeding program. And we are partnering with some of the combination of top parenting influencers, but also micro influencers before that became a huge thing who had an awesome aesthetic and were able to kind of provide on-brand content. And so kind of having this multi-pronged approach, we were able to have really, really, really strong results, engagement rates practically triple during our first campaign window. saw a notable lift in website traffic directly from social and we started to see if we were launching a new product and we would lead with social posts two days before any other advertising. We are starting to see almost sellouts from social first. And even better, the brand got great feedback from customers who said the content made them actually want to interact with the brand, which is what we were going for. And as this kind of continued through specific campaigns and through an acquisition, we wound up staying with the brand for about three years until it ultimately got brought in-house by the parent company. But it was such a joy to work with them and one of the most fun projects I've ever been a part of.

Glynis Tao

I can imagine as a parent myself, I use the products. I almost had everything from their diaper bags, change pads, play mats.

Nikki Dindo

Those diaper bags are the best and they were so cheap. I was using those to travel with.

Glynis Tao

I know, it can be used beyond just a diaper bag. It's got all the great compartments and pockets and zip and everything. It's a great design.

Nikki Dindo

They're so smart. They're the greatest products and the best, best people to work with. I truly loved working with them and they gave us so much creative flexibility and freedom and they trusted our instinct and the copy was so much fun to work on. It was just a joy.

Glynis Tao

Sounds wonderful. Let's see, what advice would you give fashion founders trying to find the right influences to represent the brand?

Nikki Dindo

I would say it's really hard. You're going to get approached as a fashion brand by so many influencers. I think the most important thing is to do your research and be selective with who you choose to partner with. Make sure that you're aligned with that there's audience alignment, of course, first and foremost, because while an influencer may have a ton of followers, if they're not aligned with who your audience is, it's going to make no difference what's up if you don't share that same audience.

So check for alignment. Make sure that their target demographic is aligned with yours because you want it to feel like a partnership. So I'd say to do your research and also make sure that you're doing something that feels comfy for you. There are so many different ways of working with influencers now, whether it's a paid partnership, whether it's an affiliate partnership, whether it's just an in-kind donation.

Find something that works for you and be clear about what that looks like. Make sure that you get everything in writing. Make sure that you get timelines in writing. Make sure that if you have any guidelines for how you want your influencer partner to shoot or any messaging, that that's provided to them in advance. If you want to see the content before it goes live, make sure that you have approval windows in there and that that process is laid out just to get crystal clear on what you're looking for. That will help make sure that you have the most successful partnership with an influencer.

Just because there's so many different ways it can go and so many different, you know, if someone says one post, it's like, okay, is that a reel? Is that a story set? Am I going to have access to the photos? There's just so much to think about. So make sure that you know exactly what it is that you're looking for and that you give them as much information as possible to help make sure it will be successful at the end of the day for you.

Glynis Tao

And is one post even enough for an influencer to...

Nikki Dindo

I’d say no and I think that also kind of goes back to that authenticity of people seeing more than one post if they see kind of a longer term partnership over you know like maybe four posts over six months or something like that. It will also kind of help build the trust in the consumer from the influencer side that hey this is a brand that they truly love that they truly do like working with and that repetition helps build brand trust. So you know to expect content from them you'll truly trust their opinion on it. So I would say to focus more on a longer term partnership rather than here's a thousand bucks. I just want one post and three story sets with one link. At the end of the day, you're going to see a better ROI from a longer term partnership with people who truly also care about your brand and want to continue that partnership as well.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, amazing. That's great advice. For fashion entrepreneurs listening today, what's one thing they could stop doing on social or PR and one thing they could start doing right now?

Nikki Dindo

Okay, so one thing to stop doing, I think I already touched on like stop trying to be everywhere all at once. But I think that the other thing to stop doing is stop trying to mimic what everyone else is doing. You don't need to follow every trend, you know, just because something is popping off. If it doesn't make sense for you, don't do it. Create your own trend. Especially if it's going to pull away from your core story or if feeling like keeping up with every trend is going to make you burn out. You don't want to do that.

So showing up consistently in one or two places with clarity will always be being scattered and stretched thin. So stop trying to be able to all at once and stop trying to do what everyone else is doing.

One thing to start doing is get comfy showing your face and telling your story behind the brand. At the end of the day, people connect with people, people buy from people, and especially in fashion where there are so many options, your unique perspective, why you started, how you design, what you believe. That's what's going to turn a follower into a fan and a fan into a customer. So even one good piece of founder led content can do more than, you know, have more impact than a dozen polished posts. So I know it feels scary sometimes to put your face out there and tell your story, but at the end of the day, your messaging will stick with people too. So stop hiding behind the grid and start trying to lead with your voice a little bit.

Glynis Tao

I love it. If a brand only has a small marketing budget, where should they focus their time and money first?

Nikki Dindo

Mm hmm. Yeah. If your budget is tight, which is totally normal, especially in those early stages, focus first on nailing your brand story and your visuals. So investing in clear messaging, a strong visual identity. And if you have really solid pieces of content that you can repurpose across platforms, as we talked about before, like if your foundation isn't clear, no amount of paid ads or PR will really help you show up or like will really land the way you want it to.

And then from there, I'd focus on prioritizing organic content. So ideally short form videos. So whether that's reels, TikTok or stories, it's still the most powerful and free way to connect, build trust and get discovered. So you don't need a huge team, just a phone, a solid plan and like a willingness to show up. And then if you do have a little bit of budget to play with once you've kind of gone through and nailed the basics, I would consider putting it towards community building. Whether that's partnering with a micro influencer and leaning into that space, doing a small giveaway, doing a partnership with like minded brands, or even hiring somebody to help you stay consistent. The goal is connection over perfection. So a few small things that can help take that off your plate and just help you stand out.

Glynis Tao

Hmm, that's amazing. So I'm hearing some of this, uh, the themes that have been repeated throughout the conversation of what you, from what you've been saying about like making sure that you have a plan, right? Be consistent. And then just kind of taking those steps, you know, little small steps will add up.

Nikki Dindo

Little small steps add up and I promise that once you have a plan and it takes the guesswork out of what you're doing, it makes it feel so much more attainable because just kind of sitting there scrolling being like, okay, I guess I should post something today that I don't know where to start makes it feel insurmountable. And that's what's going to hold you back. That's what's going to suck your time and suck your energy and then leave you feeling frustrated and overwhelmed. But if you have a solid plan, if you have six or seven kind of

core content pillars that you know you can fall back on. Or if you even just have a content calendar with ideas laid out and say, ok, I know that today I should be posting my European summer outfit suggestions. There you go. If you already have the idea. You already have content ready to go for it. And it's a matter of sitting there putting the copy together and getting a couple of images together for it. So taking that time to put together a plan will really, really help save time and help you lead with direction and clarity down the line.

Glynis Tao

Thank you. I think I could even use that advice for myself because I just find the whole task of managing social media is so overwhelming and I never know what to post.

Nikki Dindo

Even sometimes just sitting down and spending an hour or two and looking at, you know, your upcoming quarter and being like, and just testing against what you have coming up, you know, and just kind of jotting down on this day, I want to do this on that day, I want to do that and slot what launches you have against your content pillars. It'll take the guesswork out of it and make it so easy.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, cause I often second guess myself as to if I'm posting the right thing, then I don't end up posting yet.

Nikki Dindo

Yep, I actually relate to that on a deep personal level because I can do this for brands and clients non-stop. Personally, I sit there and I'm like about five years behind on posting something from my last trip, but it's because I don't have a plan and I don't have it laid out. I sit down and I get stressed. Like, I don't want to do this.

Glynis Tao

See people as even professionals struggle with this.

Nikki Dindo

Yeah, I usually sit down and kind of look at all my folders, then map out a little grid and an app and then I'm like, okay, perfect. I go into posting overdrive and we'll start doing three a day.

Glynis Tao

Let's talk about you personally because you split your time between Vancouver and New York. So how do those cities influence your creative perspective?

Nikki Dindo

Well, it's impossible to not kind of tie in the energy of New York City into anything creative. Like that city is just so vibrant and filled with so much life and so much culture, so much music. whether it's, you know, I feel like I'm always drawn to things in the arts when I'm there. So whether it's going to a jazz bar or a concert in the park, there is just so much life in that city so much movement, it creates for a dynamic environment. And so I always leave there feeling so energized and invigorated and refreshed. I also grew up in the arts. I was a singer and a dancer and pursued that for a little bit when I was on cruise ships specifically.

And so a huge thing, and when I lived in New York, or when I lived in New York, my apartment was in Hell's Kitchen, right smack in the heart of the theater district. And it's where I tend to always kind of go back to, but it was so cool to, now, wake up on a Sunday and be like, I don't have any plans today. Let me just go for a wander and see if I can rush a show and get tickets. And being able to kind of be surrounded by that creativity and that artistry. I love going and seeing all the new shows every season and am just so inspired by the artists and the artistry and the movement and the creativity.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, I can feel your passion and I mean, okay, now we have to talk about this because I heard that you are a lifelong Broadway musical theater fan. How has that passion influenced the way you show up creatively in your work?

Nikki Dindo

I think that they had to kind of ask what they know of me as a person. They'd probably say she's a traveler and she's obsessed with Hamilton.

Glynis Tao

I was gonna ask you what’s your favorite Broadway musical?

Nikki Dindo

Yeah, Hamilton hands down and it's wild to me that they are hitting their 10 year anniversary and I watched their performance a couple weeks ago at the Tony's and I was like, how is this still so good? And leave it to me to find a way to weave Hamilton into just about any client call. I've put secret nods in content sometimes. It's just like a little giggle to me if it's something super innocuous and I'm just kind of a couple of just a series of words or something like that, but it shows up in their favorite Broadway show is Hamilton by far. Lin-Manuel Miranda is our generation's William Shakespeare. He is incredibly talented. And I followed his work for years and other things, but Hamilton is just such a brilliant, brilliant, brilliant piece of theater.

Glynis Tao

Where can people find you if they want to get in touch with you?

Nikki Dindo

The best way to reach me is send me a DM on my Instagram. I'm on Instagram. My handle is at @nikkidindo. You can shoot me an email. My contact info is on my website, www.springmediaco.com. And any questions you have, if you just want to say hi, shoot me a note. I'm around.

Glynis Tao

Thank you so much, Nikki, for sharing your journey, insights, and inspiration with us today.

Nikki Dindo

Thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure.

Rooted in Heritage: The Journey of Anne Mulaire

by Glynis Tao | Jun 24, 2025 | Podcast

In this episode, Andréanne Mulaire, founder and designer of Anne Mulaire shares her journey of building a sustainable fashion brand rooted in her Métis heritage. She discusses the importance of authenticity and her commitment to ethical manufacturing and community support in the age of fast fashion. Anne emphasizes the significance of storytelling in fashion and how her cultural background influences her designs. She also highlights her initiatives to reduce waste and promote sustainability within the fashion industry, while offering valuable advice for aspiring entrepreneurs.

About Andréanne Mulaire

Anne Mulaire is an award-winning fashion brand founded by Red River Métis designer, Andréanne Mulaire Dandeneau. This woman-led brand blends ethical manufacturing, inclusivity and Indigenous teachings, setting new standards for sustainable fashion in Canada. Rooted in Winnipeg, Manitoba, the brand started 20 years ago in Andreane’s parents' basement. Her collections celebrate Métis heritage through vibrant designs, eco-friendly practices, and empowering Indigenous communities.

Innovative practices have cut the brand's carbon footprint by 30%, reduced 15,000 pounds of textile waste, and lowered emissions equal to 143,200 kilometers of driving. In 2024, Anne Mulaire received the Sustainable Business Award from the Red River Métis Excellence Awards, nomination from the Canadian Arts and Fashion Awards, and Clean 50 Award in 2025. As Canada's first Indigenous-owned B Corp certified apparel manufacturer Anne Mulaire champions integrity, transparency, and sustainability.

Contact info

Website: https://annemulaire.ca/

Instagram: @annemulaire

Facebook: AnneMulaire

Takeaways

• Stay rooted in your beliefs to maintain authenticity.
• Customers are drawn to brands with compelling stories.
• Fashion should reflect personal and cultural identity.
• Sustainability is about relationships and responsibility.
• Education plays a key role in promoting sustainability.
• Design with the end of life in mind for products.
• Navigating challenges requires resilience and creativity.
• Local community support can contribute greatly to brand success.
• Surround yourself with like-minded individuals for guidance.

Interview themes

What does it mean to build a brand rooted in cultural identity and values?

Andréanne Mulaire built her brand with a strong sense of purpose tied to her Métis heritage, a connection that informs everything from her design process to company values. Rather than following mainstream trends, she chose to tell a story through her clothing—one of resilience, craftsmanship, and community. Her parents encouraged her to define what kind of designer and entrepreneur she wanted to be from the start, prompting her to center her business around authenticity, Indigenous teachings, and environmental stewardship.

How does storytelling create emotional connection and customer loyalty?

For Andréanne, storytelling isn’t just part of her marketing—it’s embedded in the product itself. Each collection reflects family history, cultural knowledge, and artistic collaboration, especially with her father, a retired art teacher and painter. His artwork adorns many of the brand’s garments, turning them into pieces of wearable heritage. This intergenerational partnership brings meaning to the clothes and connects with customers on a deeper level. As she says, people aren’t just buying clothing—they’re investing in values, legacy, and identity.

What role does community support play in sustainable fashion entrepreneurship?

Anne Mulaire’s success is inseparable from the support of her Winnipeg community. A pivotal moment early in her journey was being encouraged to return home to launch her business, rather than chase opportunity elsewhere. That local backing—from Métis and Francophone communities to word-of-mouth support—has helped her thrive for two decades. She credits long-time customers and regional connections for helping her grow while staying true to her mission.

How does a brand stay sustainable through both design and operations?

Sustainability for Andréanne goes far beyond choosing eco-friendly fabrics. From the start, she considered the full life cycle of each product—designing garments that could be easily repaired, upcycled, or returned. Her Return to Nature program includes six streams: repair, resale, zero-waste collections, donation partnerships, fiber recycling, and research through a dedicated Fiber Lab team. She even selects construction methods that make future repairs easier, prioritizing longevity over trendiness.

What are the challenges of choosing purpose over profit?

Building a Canadian-made, Métis-owned, and sustainability-driven brand meant turning down cheaper production options and resisting industry pressure to compromise. Early advice to move offshore or “pick just one value” was difficult to hear—but Andréanne stayed rooted in her purpose. This clarity helped her withstand challenges and remain authentic, even when Indigenous storytelling was not widely celebrated. Her experience illustrates that resilience and long-term thinking are essential for founders who want to stay aligned with their values.

How do you scale a mission-driven brand without losing authenticity?

Andréanne recognizes the tension between growth and integrity. Her solution is to selectively scale only certain pieces of the business while maintaining exclusivity and cultural respect in others, such as her Heritage Collection. She believes not everything should be mass produced—and that the handmade, small-batch approach keeps the soul of the brand intact. Even as she plans new ventures like a Banff boutique, she stays grounded in the company’s origins and mission.

How can design decisions support circularity from the start?

Every design decision at Anne Mulaire is made with circularity in mind—from fiber selection to stitch type. For example, she deliberately avoids certain seam finishes because they’re harder to repair. These behind-the-scenes considerations, like making leggings easier to mend, have kept hundreds of garments in circulation. To date, the company has repaired over 800 pairs of leggings that would have otherwise ended up in landfills. Andréanne’s team even quantifies product-level impact by displaying water, energy, and carbon savings on the website—offering full transparency into their sustainability efforts.

What advice does Andréanne have for aspiring fashion entrepreneurs?

Start with your “why” and let it guide every decision, Andréanne says. Don’t wait for perfection—launch small, stay curious, and keep learning. Surround yourself with people who share your values, and don’t be afraid to pivot when needed. Hire slowly and intentionally, and prioritize your own well-being. Andréanne emphasizes that success isn’t about fast growth or big profits—it’s about building a business that creates positive impact and stays true to its purpose over time.

Chapters

00:00 Staying Rooted in Authenticity

02:06 The Birth of a Brand: Inspiration and Heritage

09:54 Filling the Gap: Ethical Fashion in a Fast Fashion World

11:48 Defining Sustainability: Values and Relationships

17:57 Navigating Challenges: Staying True to Values

20:32 Community Support: The Backbone of Success

23:50 Creating Impact: Education and Sustainability Initiatives

30:06 Designing for the Future: End-of-Life Considerations

34:07 Looking Ahead: Future Projects and Growth

35:30 Advice for Aspiring Entrepreneurs: Starting with Your Why

Transcript

Andréanne Mulaire

What's really important is to stay rooted because the reason I'm still in business today is because I stayed rooted in what I really believed and nobody can take that away. It is my story and it makes me who I am and it makes me also different than other companies. So I think that's very important because even today it's about, well, why are you special? Like how can you make yourself special? Because customers want, they don't want the same thing. They want authenticity, they want the, you know, the real of a company and their story. They're attracted to storytelling to different companies and their different stories. Yeah, it made me who I am differently from other competitors and something that could not be replicated.

Glynis Tao

Welcome to Chase Your Dreams, a podcast for fashion entrepreneurs who want to build a purposeful and profitable clothing business so they can make a living doing what they love. I'm your host, Glynis Tao, an apparel business consultant and SEO specialist with 20 years apparel industry experience. I'm also a mom to a wonderfully energetic little boy named Chase.

Anne Mulaire is an award-winning fashion brand founded by Red River Métis designer, Andreane Mulaire Dandeneau. This woman-led brand blends ethical manufacturing, inclusivity and Indigenous teachings, setting new standards for sustainable fashion in Canada. Rooted in Winnipeg, Manitoba, the brand started 20 years ago in Andreane’s parents' basement. Her collections celebrate Métis heritage through vibrant designs, eco-friendly practices, and empowering Indigenous communities.

Innovative practices have cut the brand's carbon footprint by 30%, reduced 15,000 pounds of textile waste, and lowered emissions equal to 143,200 kilometers of driving. In 2024, Anne Mulaire received the Sustainable Business Award from the Red River Métis Excellence Awards, nomination from the Canadian Arts and Fashion Awards, and Clean 50 Award in 2025.

As Canada's first Indigenous-owned B Corp certified apparel manufacturer Anne Mulaire champions integrity, transparency, and sustainability.

Welcome Anne, it's so nice to have you here today. Thanks for joining me on the podcast.

Andréanne Mulaire

You're so welcome. Thank you for the invite.

Glynis Tao

My pleasure. You have such an incredible and inspiring story, having established a name in the Canadian fashion industry. I felt I needed to talk to you and have you share your story with our listeners.

Andréanne Mulaire

That's awesome. I love to share it. I don't always have the opportunity, so I really appreciate the time that you're taking aside for me.

Glynis Tao

Great. So let's start at the beginning. What inspired you to launch Angoulas? Was there a specific moment or experience that sparked the idea?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah, well, I always loved creating with my hands. So the real spark came from wanting to see fashion that reflected who I was, my Métis roots, my respect for the earth, my belief that clothes should be made with care and intention. From a long time ago, I was always very mindful about the planet. And that's how the values that my parents instilled in me.

So when I was in school in Montreal, when I was doing my fashion school, I was always using natural fibers. The moment that my aha moment, when we talk about those moments, it's when I was doing my last year exam and we had to create a couture dress. And I really wanted to do something in the natural fibers. So I decided to do a dress in hemp. And I was adamant to create a dress that was red carpet.

Because the feedback I had received from when I mentioned that to my teachers, they said, well, don't be surprised if it does not end up on the runway. And if you had your dress on the runway, you had extra points. So it's, it's almost like you, you had to have it on the runway. And so I thought, okay, I'm going to prove them wrong because obviously they don't know the capacity of what natural can look like. So I really worked hard on hemp silk, hemp jacquard, hemp lace.

I looked everywhere and I had sourced some fabric in the US and I had paid everything with my own cents and dollars and I made this beautiful dress all in hemp and they were so surprised and they could not believe that it was a natural fiber and I felt like, am I educating you about this today?

So that's where I really felt I had a space in the fashion industry. The fact that first of all, people didn't believe in me or in the fact that I could create something for the runway in eco fabrics and also the education about fashion, runway fashion shouldn't be disposable. It should be something that you're taking from the earth and you got to give it back to the earth somehow. So what's that cycle and that, you know, that mini education.

So all this to say that was the big spark, but also if I fast forward a little bit, so I started my company in my parents' basement and what I also noticed was, I remember a moment where my dad was, we were collaborating together and I had showed up in the morning and he was still in his house coat, no coffee in hand and painting on our dresses that we had collaborated. And I had really thought through at that moment, I'm like, you know what, we are creating something special. This is not just clothing we're doing, but we're really creating something meaningful together. And that was the path. That's like the big decisions on everything that I put behind the company and the mindfulness about that decisions that I put into the company comes from those moments.

Glynis Tao

Your Métis heritage and family history play such an important role in your brand's story. Can you tell us more about your cultural background and how it shaped the brand's identity?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah, so my Métis heritage, it's at the heart of everything we do. Growing up, I was surrounded with stories, beadwork, florals, traditions that holds really big history and resilience. And so I was really honored that I was able to create clothing that tells a story. That's huge for me.

The one question my parents asked me before starting my company, they said, what kind of designer do you want to be? What kind of business owner do you want to be? Because at that point, I thought I was just going to be an artist and create clothing. But they said, no, you're going to become an entrepreneur by doing what you love to do. So what kind of entrepreneur, what kind of designer, what story are you going to tell? That really made me think about who I am and where I came from, you know, the rest is. So I was very proud to use my story and to tell a story through craftsmanship and every way that I could through my clothing. And I find it, you can see, you look at the clothing and I personally, see roots, you see the rooted, you know, the value rooted in them. And I'm hoping to pass that down to generations with respect, sustainability and community.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, absolutely. I could really see that heritage woven into your designs. Just like such beautiful, you know, wearable art, I guess, if you could call it that. And where do you get the art, you know, the designs that you put on your clothing from?

Andréanne Mulaire

So that's with my dad. So this is where I think it's so special because we've been collaborating for 20 years. And I do find it's the one of the most special things. He was an art teacher before. So to see him going back to his first love of art, I remember when he was a kid, he would be, all his brothers, sisters would be on the farm, working on the farm. And his dad had asked, my grandpa had asked him to be in the kitchen and to paint the house, the homestead.

And so he was loving, know, he's like, I didn't have to be on the farm, but I was painting the homestead and his dad's like, you are an artist. And I could just feel him, you know, when he was a kid and just that feeling like that proudness.

And so when I started my company, he was also retiring. So we started just the fact that I said, I want to keep my story alive and just share the indigenous people history of Canada. Cause I find fashion and history go hand in hand. It's very important. So that's what he started doing paintings and we would say, on this dress, it would be amazing to have, what's a healing plant that we use and Northern Willow and let's tell the story of that, okay. And then for leggings, how about what can we draw? And we would do these beautiful collaborations. And to today, all the art is made by him. And sometimes we do other collaborations with other artists, which is really nice. That's super special too. So that's definitely a family affair.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, it definitely is. That's really nice.

Andréanne Mulaire

I was thinking about that today too because I do find it special also because it's his legacy continuing, his education, his storytelling, his stories. And I find every time we talk about something like a new launch or a new design, there's so much depth and wisdom that I gather from that. And that print, they never go away. They're so classic. They're so timeless that it gives so much hope and just also you know strength and just so much love to other people buying it. They feel it. I find that's it's so beautiful, that's authenticity of craftsmanship, but you know of good quality. Products, you know, you know something that has good values.

Glynis Tao

And so when you started the brand early days, what gap did you see in the fashion industry that you felt compelled to fill?

Andréanne Mulaire

Well, this is no surprise, but we know fast fashion is everywhere and it's disconnected from the land. Like we know that from the maker, from the story. So I wanted to, I wanted to slow it down. I knew it was going to be a huge undertaking because a small fish in the big pond, you think about that. But I saw we needed more ethical, inclusive and cultural-conscious fashion made clothing that's made here in Canada. That was the biggest thing. Not just clothing that looks good, but do good. And that customers, when you think about it, they invest a lot of their hard money. It's like everybody that makes money, they work hard for their money. And they invest, when they buy things, you invest in the companies. That's the way I think of purchasing, consummation. I think of that every time I put in my dollars in something, you know, do I support their value? I, my investment, where is that going to go?

So I want to bring that back and just to put, you know, make, make sure that there could be a company, fashion company that would respond to a lot of what the fast fashion can't and to show it's possible in Canada.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, and that's really what I love about you and your brand and having that longevity to be in business for as long as you have, showing that you can be sustainable and be purpose driven, lead with your values and not just, you know, that there's only fast fashion as the option out there, right?

Yeah. so sustainability is at the core of your brands. How did you define find what sustainability would look like for Anne Mulaire from the start.

Andréanne Mulaire

Okay, so it's not easy. It's not always easy. But for me, it came down to relationships and responsibility. So I stay grounded by listening to my community, that's number one, and collaborating with other Indigenous artists or elders and always checking in with myself. I think that's super important. What aligns, what doesn't align with my values, you know, making decisions. I've had to do a lot of tough decisions throughout my 20 years in business.

And it's not always like they say, it's not the easy decision is the right decision. And so that has always been very important for me to always make sure I do my due diligence. And at the end of the day, do I still want to wake up in the morning and face myself and say, I made the right decision because that's what I believe in. But yeah, it's always about, you know, growth is important, so we always have to do it, but integrity is non-negotiable for a lot of what I do.

Glynis Tao

I love that. And you say a lot of that on your website as well, that you list a lot of those values to your brand. So I guess just to take it one step further in terms of your designs are beautifully blend together, indigenous culture, equal consciousness and modern fashion.

How do you stay true to your values while ensuring cultural authenticity and respect as the business growth?

Andréanne Mulaire

Well, there's one thing that, so we have a really nice collection in our brand. It's called the Heritage Collection. And those are pieces that we make small amounts of because I believe that scaling, like something special can't be scaled. So when you think about scaling, see big, as soon as a company scales, they lose their authenticity. They lose their integrity. But for us, it's always been important that, you know, we need growth. We want to grow, but what pieces are growing and which pieces are staying authentic. And, you know, absolutely it's always, it's hard with the capital and things like that. But I think at the end, it's just, you know, working from my parents' basement and doing everything myself, I was able to really analyze and just understand every step of a company. And even today, you know, I learned, now I find I'm in the part where I learned a lot of the business side. And that's where you have to be careful because you will be told so many different directions to go. You know, but you have to be rooted so strong in the beginning where you, you know, where are proud to be for those decisions, not to weigh you on one side or the other kind of thing. I don't know if I'm making kind of sense.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, it does. Just to ask you another question, do you have any mentors or teachers that have helped you along this way, along your journey?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah, I think it's always important to try to surround yourself with the right people that carries the same values. So of course, I've had my family, I have an older brother that also is an entrepreneur, and he's been very supportive and being honest with his mistakes for me not to make the same mistakes. And I really appreciate that. You know, that's vulnerable to appreciate that. And, and just to have other business owners that I really value what they do and just having their feedback on things. I think that's important. You can't do it alone. And there's so much that you don't know. And so I always say, you know, educate, educate, educate.

Glynis Tao

But let's talk about the behind the scenes. What were some of the biggest challenges you faced in the early stages of the brand?

Andréanne Mulaire

Well, definitely the time I was told that offshore production should be the thing I should head to because I should cut my costs and then go offshore. The fact that I had the triple threat, is Métis-owned, Métis-designed, Made in Canada and sustainability, I should just only pick one. So those are all things that definitely was very hard to swallow and just to acknowledge because yes, those were the things that I was really believing in and are very hard to grow a company where profits are not huge. Right?

When you make in Canada, you don't get the same profit as when you do overseas. When you have a, you know, an indigenous story where at the beginning in 2005, not a lot of people were very positive about the fact that I was, you know, telling my Indigenous story, and so it was not super popular. But you navigate through those times and again makes what's really important is to stay rooted because the reason I'm still in business today is because I stayed rooted in what I really believed and nobody can take that away.

It is my authentic, story, and it makes me who I am. And it makes me also different than other companies. So I think that's very important because even today it's about, well, why are you special? Like, how can you make yourself special? Because customers want, they don't want the same thing. They want the authenticity. They want the, you know, the real of a company and their story. They're attracted to storytelling to different companies and their different stories. So yeah, it made me who I am differently from other competitors and something that could not be replicated by just copying, you know.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, so it sounds like you have really stayed true to yourself as a designer, as a brand, being B-Court certified too is an amazing achievement, right? Because I know that's not easy the whole process to be certified. Like have you ever faced any pressures to compromise your values in order to grow and how did you navigate that?

Andréanne Mulaire

Well, again, definitely the pressure with the fast fashion, you know, the consummation. So a great example is when Black Friday comes along. It's like, how do you compete with all the brands doing so many amazing deals? And at the end, it's you have to, and this is where, you know, my mentors have always told me, stay true to who you are. Don't give in just because you feel like you have to, because then you'll just be a part of what they're doing.

You're not gonna be on your, you know, you're not gonna be your unique self. So, you know, it's about being creative and when you are a minority in so many aspects, you start to be very creative and think outside the box and find unique ways to look different. So that's what I think we've been, not I think, I believe that we've been like so good at doing that because from the beginning, it's almost, called resilience. It's like going through so many obstacles and trying to say, how do I get out of it? And then you find another way to pivot and find another way to pivot. 

It's almost to the point where we are experts in pivoting because we've gone through so many obstacles, you know? And so it's always, I'm sure we're going to go through more obstacles, but it's always going to be okay. What is the right way versus what's the right thing to do in this moment? And how do we stay also true to our values and to what the brand means to a lot of people and to us. so, but to go back to the B Corp, that was huge for us because it like it validated everything that we've been working towards, social responsibility, environmental standards, ethical practices.

But you know, to be honest, like the honest, to be honest, one of the biggest moment that I have more personal, but it's been more personal for me. It was seeing customers wear our clothing to like family gatherings and to share what it means to them to connect with their culture. Like I think sometimes having these stamps or, you know, awards, those are great because it's almost a social proof. But at the end of the day, it's really seeing the amount of customers you build and the community you build wearing what you're making.

For anybody that's an artist, seeing your product sold in a house or seeing somebody wearing your jewelry is the most proud moment that you can imagine. And I think that's what the effect is on a small company versus a huge brand because you don't have that person that gets affected right away.

Glynis Tao

Love that. And I think that leads right into my next question, which is how important has your local community been in supporting the brand from Winnipeg to the broader Canadian fashion scene?

Andréanne Mulaire

So important, you know, it makes or breaks your brand, your business, if you don't have support from your community. Word of mouth. I always say word of mouth is the best marketing tactic because they believe people take who their loved ones seriously versus if we could put so much money in marketing, but it wouldn't have the same effect as the word of mouth or having a friend saying to a friend and also the support of the French community, the Métis community. It makes a huge difference. I'll tell you a story.

So after school, I graduated in Montreal for fashion. Then I decided to go to Toronto because I thought, I'm going to get a job in Toronto. That's where it should be. But then I had a meeting with Michael Silver from Silver Jeans in Winnipeg and he said, come back to Winnipeg. Your community will support you. You'll be able to open your store or your boutique or whatever you want to. You need that support. And he was not wrong. Like it's exactly what I did. I packed up myself. I came back to Winnipeg and I started my company and I've had the, you know, immense support from everybody since then. And I couldn't have done it alone. So I always say my successes is the people that support me, my community, my customers that's been with me for 20 years. I've had customers with me for 20 years, you know? It's amazing.

Glynis Tao

That is amazing and I'm actually quite impressed of how many there are quite a few apparel companies in Winnipeg right. It's like you mentioned silver jeans. Is Canada Goose based there?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah, have their, that's where the old silver jeans where they used to manufacture. Now they have some of the, that manufacture.

Glynis Tao

They do, right?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah. And they have their factory there amongst others.

Glynis Tao

So that's great. It's really great to hear that you're able to build a clothing brand and a successful clothing brand out of your hometown. Yeah. I mean, that must feel great to be able to do what you love in the city that you grew up in.

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah, as much as know entrepreneurship is it's it's not easy but that's the beauty of you know believing in your product and the fact that I get to wake up every day and I know I'm making a difference because I have you know how many people I've employed in Winnipeg and the fact that they love working here they feel like a family I love that feeling coming in and hearing them laugh it's one of the best sounds and you know the fact that I'm able to share a lot of my knowledge and also my values to a lot of customers that wanted to transition in sustainability but didn't know how or what.

And I find our education has really helped them even with our Return to Nature programs, the fact that they can bring it back, get repaired and all that. I hear more and more, this is my first piece and I'm so excited to keep on just growing slowly and those are just music to my ears when I hear that creating impact. And that's another thing that when I started the company, I had made myself, I knew I wanted to create a change. That was the number one. I wanted to reduce it with the waste in the industry, in the fashion industry. I had done some courses at the University of Manitoba in human ecology. So I had done a lot of case studies about the child labor, the behind the scene before actually I did my fashion industry at fashion school.

So I knew that behind the scene more and the waste and the fabrics. so I already knew that we were using it. It was going beyond. And so when I started a company, it was really to reduce the waste, but also to create fashion in a way more ethically and sustainable way. But to see customers seeing our company and then wanting to follow and transition into that slow fashion, that sustainable movement, that's our impact. And I said, yeah, maybe I don't make a lot of money in my pocket.

I'm not a big profit person. But that's not my goal. My goal is to be a CEO that creates impact versus a CEO that creates profit.

Glynis Tao

Can you speak a little bit about your initiatives on like how you divert textile waste, you are reducing carbon emissions? 

Andréanne Mulaire

I can go for days because I love talking about that. But so in 2021, we did a really full audit of our whole supply chain. And it's really cool because you can go on our site and when you're looking at different products, you can see how much carbon emission you're saving from that product, water, energy saving. So it gives you real time of the positive impact of that product. So that's one thing. But we also launched a whole return to nature program, which it's like a, it's the holistic approach to reducing waste in our own company. Cause again, on a side note, I always say every company is, should be, should be responsible for their own waste. So whatever waste you create, if it's energy, if it's tangible or whatever, you should be responsible for your own waste. So for us, it was important to look at a holistic approach and see how customers can participate as well.

So our Return to Nature program is based on six programs. Number one, it's repair, where you can bring back any clothing that you have and we will repair it. We also have a 90-day guarantee, so we repair for free. And then second is a resale program, where, okay, you've worn your piece, so you have older piece, you bring it back, and then it's a take-back program, basically.

And then we have our revive and slash zero waste collection program where we will upcycle and reuse waste from our post production. So the season before production remnants, when we've done our big cuts, we have like bags. So we'll do a collection twice a year. It's called the zero waste collection and we reuse those. And that's a fun, creative, one of a kind collection. And then we have three more but that's more on the back end of because doing these programs in order to have it fully circular, there's some research and development that needs to be done. we have the fourth is the down cycle. So that's where we have remnants, but we can't do anything with that. But we do donate to any community engagement or community areas.

We just had a company come in, a nonprofit, and they were filling out punching bags and they came in and grabbed four bags and they're filling those up and then these are for community activities this summer. And so amazing, cool project that we get to hear about. And then we also have our down cycle, is where we have the down cycle and the recycle and we have fiber lab. So fiber lab is our team that does all the research and development for new fibers. That's where we did a collaboration with University of Manitoba.

And we looked at the bi-gradable ability of our fabrics and how do we move to the next phase to finding bi-gradable fabrics. So they're doing the research and development of all that. And our bio cycle and recycling program is where we did, we launched that last fall and we're going to continue this fall where we use 10,000 pounds of our waste and we recycled it in these socks. We did socks for the first time because it's universal.

But that was the one, our goal is to create clothing so we don't have, I mean, fabric. So we don't want to be buying virgin fabric all the time. But ideally would be to recycle your own waste into fabric so then you can just keep recycling. So it becomes a full loop all the time. And at the end of the day, you know, you can't do that forever.

But if you can relieve, if you can keep things in the loop a bit longer, and this is great for any customers, think hearing this, you keep your shirt, you wear your shirt longer, maybe two or three months longer, it takes away so many carbon emission and also water from the landfill. And it just, that's the key of keeping things off the landfill and to be sustainable. It's to wear things longer. And so keeping into the loop, that's the key of sustainability.

Glynis Tao

Do you actually consider all that at the very beginning of the design process then? You're probably considering the end of life?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yes. Yeah, that's a great question because a lot of people, don't know, but when we design our collection, we always design with the end life first, and then we move forward and, you know, we move to the design. A lot of the times, you know, people are looking at a fabric and they're like, that's pretty. Okay, I'm going to design and then they go to the end life. But then that fabric might not be composable or it could be 100% plastic, which will take 200 plus years to decompose. It could have synthetics or it could have zippers or buttons, which is totally fine. for us, either way I design is I always think, okay, well, if anybody had to repair this, how would I repair this? Okay, I need to make sure that it's repairable because that goes into my loop.

I need to make sure that the fabric is as natural as possible because at the end life, it will go to this space, this place here. And so those are the questions that I asked myself. Then a very good example is we do a lot of leggings. So the leggings are one of our best sellers. And I was contemplating on getting a flat stitch, which is the stitch that kind of goes like this. And it's a flat stitch that you see a lot of on big brands' leggings.

The only thing with these stitches is that you can't repair it. It's a very hard way to repair it when it breaks. So this is a decision that I had to make, okay, well, I can't have what everybody else has, but I'll go with my serger because I know I can repair it. And you should have repaired over 800 leggings over the years. And that's like leggings that would have been tossed in the landfill and just discarded. These are leggings that are still in the loop. And so that for me, those are decisions that I make that a lot of customers or people don't even know. It's like, yeah, I guess so.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, totally get what you're saying. It's the flat lock machine. Yeah. So I guess you would do the surge and cover stitch. Yeah. So that's right? That would make it easier to put them at the repairing stage. Do you do all your production and how?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yes, we do. I have just across my door right here, I have the whole manufacturer. So when you come to the shop, you get to see, you know, everything being made. It's almost like the kitchen behind, how do you call that? The open kitchen, open manufacturer. So yeah, I'll take a little video after and send it to you so you can have it.

Glynis Tao

Yes, please. I would love to be able to share that too with our listeners so they get a little bit more behind the scenes look, you know, your manufacturing process, because that's not really a lot, people don't get to see that.

Andréanne Mulaire 

Yeah, exactly.

They usually see the end, the product at the end and don't see all the things that happen in between. We know when we're at the restaurant and we see the chef cooking, it's so special. It's like, how is he doing that? how's, well, that's cool. You know? And I started doing little reels with my sewers and asking them what's the hardest part of different products. And it's so cool because I get to hear this too. like, oh, I didn't know that was the hardest part of a blazer. What's the hardest parts of this dress? And then they tell me, you know, it's kind of cool now.

Glynis Tao

So what's next for Anne Mulaire? Are there any upcoming projects, collections or partnerships that you're excited about?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah, well, we're going to continue to grow, expand the circular program, the take back and the repair, and then also try to do more recycled textile to textile recycling. But we're also working on opening a boutique in Banff, which is a dream. I'm still working hard on that, but that's going to be something that we can really bring made to Canada, indigenous owned in Banff. So I think customers will, and for all international, that's the way I see international people coming through, you know, to see the thing real, what's real about Canada. I think that would be really nice. Yeah. And then just to continue to do some really nice collaboration with Métis artisans and, but those are the big things.

Glynis Tao

And you are mostly D to C right now, you sell off your website. Do you do wholesale and do you stock anywhere?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah, we don't do wholesale, used to in 2008, I had a lot of stores and I had to pivot because of the market crashed. And so that was one of my pivots. And then we went just direct to consumer, which again was easier for us because we didn't have to use as much fabric. I could create smaller runs and answer demands on, you know, when they came versus when I was doing wholesale, it was just a lot right off the bat. If they didn't pay on time. Like it was just a lot of management, but we're looking at maybe opening again, the wholesale department next year and just having selective things. I think it's important to try to get Canadian made t-shirts. I find like, again, I know where they, your t-shirts, have to be a certain price point, but there's something being said about Canadian t-shirts being well-made. I think we've had the experience of wearing crappy t-shirts enough, but good quality t-shirts, we're going to start to want to embrace that and to want to invest in those. Just other pieces that we can offer, that would be good.

Glynis Tao

If you could give advice to a young entrepreneur or fashion designer, what would it be?

Andréanne Mulaire

Thinking about everything I went through, I would say starting with your why. So know what you stand for before you launch anything. I believe it's going to guide you with every decision that you have to make, but also don't wait till everything's perfect to launch. You know, just start something and then learn as you go, but always surround yourself with people that share the same values and the same visions. And yeah, I believe that's how you build something that lasts.

Glynis Tao

And just, I guess, reflecting back over the last 20 years, you know, building the brand, how has it changed you as a person?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah. Well, I'm definitely more patient now, but it has opened my eyes to seeing what's happening more outside. You know, in the beginning, you're very inward and you're very focused, but I was able to just open my eyes and seeing more of what is happening around me and letting fate kind of just do its thing.

Glynis Tao

Are you able to sort of step back a little bit more and be able to sort of look at things kind of on a broader view, know, macro level than a very micro level? Because I think when, you know, starting out as a new designer, you got your hands in like everything, right? And having to do everything.

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah, no, you're right. If I think about, you know, physically, physically in terms of my workload, I think another very important thing is, is finding the right people for the right jobs. The resource, a lot of companies will say resource or HR is always, it's a lot of work, but it's very important and take your time. Sometimes it's okay to take your time for that, but having the right team allows me to step back and just to work more on the company versus in the company.

And that's something I've learned too over the years of you're working so much in the company. If you do that too much, then you start not to see what is happening because you're so focused on one thing. And also just the importance for any entrepreneur is to really take at least, you know, if possible. I try to do that is, is, you know, a me day or a weekend every season, because there's a reason why there's seasons, things change.

And it's also your, a person also change and in order to refresh to, you know, to be the best self for the company. Cause you're there. If you're not your best self, then everybody else is suffering around you. So it's important to be your best self around your company, about your, your employees and to take time for yourself. Cause that's the number one thing is you become a workaholic. It's so easy. Right. So, and balance is, very hard. A lot of people will say, I try to balance it. I've been working on balance for 20 years, but you know, being able to put a few things like hiring the right people and if sometimes it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out. But you keep your goal is always to hire the right people. And when you have strong core values and you hire and you fire with those in mind, you'll get the right people.

Glynis Tao

That's great advice. Where can people find you if they want to get in touch with you?

Well, they can find me on the website and they can send an email there or through our Instagram. We have Facebook, we have LinkedIn, we have a YouTube channel too. yeah, if they just search Anne Mulaire or I guess we could put that in the caption.

Glynis Tao

Yes. We will put all your contact info.

They can come and check out the boutique in Winnipeg. It's a really nice experience. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, sorry. I didn't maybe forgot to say we have the boutique connected to Anne Mulaire we'll I'll take a video for you too. So you can show it to them. It's connected to the manufacturing facility.

Glynis Tao

So you have like a design studio and a factory and then a store. Please send us a video of that or if that is a bit is it on your website?

Andréanne Mulaire

Yeah, you have this location that says the boutique, a little picture of the boutique, but I'll send you a video of the manufacturer and then going through the boutique and

Glynis Tao

Okay, yes. And I will add that to the Reels highlight when I post it, because I'm sure people would want to love to see it. I would love to see it. Next best thing to flying to Winnipeg, right? Thank you. You are so lucky.

Glynis Tao

Thank you for sharing your story with us. It's been so inspiring to hear how you've built a brand rooted in heritage, sustainability and purpose.

Andréanne Mulaire

You are so welcome. Thank you so much for the time, like the space that you let me blab.

Glynis Tao

My pleasure. And for anyone listening, you can learn more about Anne Mulaire and explore the collections at annemulaire.ca, your website. And thank you again for joining us today.

How to Build a Values-led Sustainable Fashion Brand

by Glynis Tao | Jun 17, 2025 | Podcast

In this episode, we are joined by Shannon, owner of Simply Merino—a sustainable clothing brand based in Vancouver and specializing in Australian Merino wool. She shares her journey from teacher to fashion entrepreneur, and discusses how her values around sustainability, transparency, and community support have shaped the brand. The conversation explores the early challenges of running a business, the benefits of using natural fibers, and how customer feedback plays a central role in product development. Shannon also reflects on her recent trip to Australia to visit wool suppliers and offers a look at what’s next for Simply Merino, including upcoming product launches and textile recycling initiatives.

About Shannon

Shannon is the owner of Simply Merino, a Canadian clothing brand based in Vancouver that creates ultra-soft, sustainable everyday essentials for the whole family. Made exclusively from Australian Merino wool, Simply Merino offers cozy sweats, elevated basics, swimwear, and sleepwear designed with a minimalist aesthetic and a commitment to conscious living. With all production done locally in Canada, Shannon is closely involved in every stage of the process—from design to manufacturing—ensuring both quality and transparency.

Driven by a deep commitment to sustainability, Shannon has grown Simply Merino into a purpose-led brand that goes beyond fabric choices. Under her leadership, the company has diverted over 15,000 pounds of textile waste from landfills through its recycling initiatives. Her values as a mother, environmentalist, and small business owner continue to shape the brand’s mission. Whether it's educating customers on the benefits of natural fibers or building long-term supplier relationships, Shannon is redefining what it means to build a thoughtful, values-led sustainable fashion business from the ground up.

Contact info

Website: www.simplymerino.ca

Email: shannon@simplymarino.com

Instagram: @simply_merino

Facebook: SimplyMerino

Takeaways

• Lead with your values to attract the right customers to your brand.
• Be transparent to build trust and connect more deeply with your audience.
• Involve your customers, but stay true to your design principles and brand identity.
• Be prepared to learn through trial and error if you’re starting without industry experience.
• Focus on niche communities that naturally align with your brand’s values.
• Local production supports quality, ethics, and long-term operational flexibility.
• Stay mission-driven, especially during the early challenges of running a small brand.

Interview themes

What does it mean to build a values-led fashion brand?

Simply Merino’s growth has been rooted in a deep commitment to values rather than profits. When Shannon took over the business, she was driven by her passion for sustainability, natural living, and creating something meaningful—not the idea of building a fashion empire.

Her background as an environmentalist and holistic health practitioner naturally informed the direction of the brand, which prioritizes natural fibers, ethical manufacturing, and thoughtful design. This purpose-led approach has shaped everything from her material choices to how she communicates with customers.

How can transparency strengthen brand loyalty?

In the early stages of running Simply Merino, Shannon hesitated to show the reality behind the brand because she felt small compared to polished competitors. Over time, she realized that being open about the production process, working from home, and the brand’s modest beginnings actually created deeper trust.

Today, she actively shares how garments are made, who makes them, and why certain decisions are made. A major turning point in this journey was visiting her Merino wool supplier in Australia and sharing that story with customers. These behind-the-scenes moments help reinforce customer loyalty and show that the brand is committed to full transparency.

How do customer relationships influence product development?

Shannon’s design process is closely tied to feedback from her community. While she remains the final decision-maker on what gets produced, many product ideas originate from customer suggestions. For example, her expansion into women’s wear and eventually men’s designs was a direct response to customer interest. However, she only moves forward with designs that reflect her own sense of style and comfort, ensuring that each piece aligns with the brand’s identity. This balance of listening and leading helps ensure the line remains both relevant and authentic.

What are the challenges of growing a sustainable fashion business from scratch?

Taking over an existing brand presented challenges Shannon hadn’t anticipated. While there was an initial customer base, she had no fashion or business background and had to learn everything through trial and error. Early production issues with manufacturers led to faulty products and difficult customer situations, compounded by the stress of juggling a young family and limited financial resources. The early years were marked by exhaustion and self-doubt, but those experiences laid the groundwork for later resilience and clarity around her business values.

How can niche communities drive organic brand growth?

Without a traditional marketing strategy, Simply Merino’s growth has largely come from word-of-mouth and community support. Shannon discovered that homesteading groups, outdoor education networks, and families interested in natural living were particularly drawn to her products.

These niche audiences helped spread awareness about the brand, and their interest shaped how Shannon continued to position and market her garments. This grassroots growth strategy proved more effective than paid advertising, aligning naturally with her values-led approach.

Why is local manufacturing a strength, not a limitation?

Keeping production in Vancouver has been a cornerstone of Simply Merino’s operations. By building long-term relationships with local manufacturers, Shannon has been able to maintain quality control and streamline communication. If issues arise, they can be resolved quickly and in person.

Beyond logistics, she sees local production as a way to support the skilled labor force in her city and ensure ethical working conditions. Recent shifts in consumer awareness—especially during the COVID-19 pandemic and after tariff changes—have only increased interest in Canadian-made products.

How does sustainability go beyond fabric choice?

The brand’s sustainability efforts extend far beyond its use of Merino wool. One of Simply Merino’s most significant projects has been collecting and recycling fabric scraps from production—over 15,000 pounds so far. These scraps have been sent to North Carolina for processing into new yarn, which Shannon plans to turn into products like socks, hats, and blankets. This focus on circularity demonstrates how the brand is committed to reducing waste and continuously improving its environmental impact.

What advice does Shannon have for women starting sustainable fashion brands?

Shannon encourages aspiring founders to be honest about their motivations and prepared for hard work. For her, success came from being transparent, staying aligned with her values, and building genuine relationships with customers. She cautions that the road is slow and often financially difficult in the early years, but that staying mission-driven can lead to long-term fulfillment. Her journey reflects the importance of storytelling, adaptability, and owning your identity as a founder, even when the business is small.

Chapters

00:00 The Journey to Sustainable Fashion

02:58 Building a Values-Driven Brand

06:09 The Role of Natural Fibers in Fashion

09:06 Transparency and Customer Involvement

12:04 Challenges of Running a Small Business

14:56 Growth and Community Support

17:49 The Importance of Local Production

21:07 Sustainability in the Supply Chain

23:59 Educating Consumers on Sustainable Choices

26:58 Lessons Learned and Personal Growth

30:04 Future Goals and Innovations

33:04 Advice for Aspiring Entrepreneurs

Transcript

Shannon

I try to explain and educate. But it's my job, I feel, to educate customers or potential customers the importance, and again, not only my shop, but to understand what they're buying and who they're buying from just to make sure that they feel good. I know that so many people don't have the means really to buy slow fashion or educate themselves on the importance and if my customers are choosing my shop to buy something from me when I know most people are financially in a hard time like that that fills my heart and it makes me understand the importance of what they want. You know, like they want to know who they're buying from and I'm honored that they're buying from us.

Glynis Tao

Welcome to Chase Your Dreams, a podcast for fashion entrepreneurs who want to build a purposeful and profitable clothing business so they can make a living doing what they love. I'm your host, Glynis Tao, an apparel business consultant and SEO specialist with 20 years apparel industry experience. I'm also a mom to a wonderfully energetic little boy named Chase.

Welcome to Chase Your Dreams podcast where we dive into the stories behind purpose-driven brands and the people shaping the future of fashion. Today, I'm joined by Shannon, the owner of Simply Merino, a Canadian clothing brand known for its incredibly soft, sustainable everyday essentials crafted exclusively from Australian Merino wool. From cozy sweats, t-shirts and swimwear to elevated basics for women, men and kids.

Simply Merino is redefining comfort with a focus on minimalism, quality, and conscious living. Based in Vancouver, Simply Merino designs and manufactures all of its pieces in Canada, allowing them to be personally involved in every stage of creation. At the heart of the brand is Australian Merino Wool, an incredibly soft, temperature-regulating, and durable fiber that's also naturally renewable, biodegradable, and doesn't release harmful microplastics when washed.

Shannon's commitment to sustainability goes beyond fabric choice. In fact, Merino has kept over 15,000 pounds of fabric scraps out of landfills through its own recycling efforts. In this episode, we talk about what it means to build a values led brand, how Simply Merino is tackling textile waste head on, and the challenges and rewards of growing a fashion business from the ground up. So let's get into it.

Welcome Shannon. It's so nice to have you here today. Thanks for joining me on the podcast.

Shannon

Thank you so much for having me. That was a really great introduction. Thank you.

my pleasure. I think you have an incredible brand that's quite unique because you make all your clothing from Australian Merino wool and you make it right here in Canada.

That's right, we're very lucky, right in Vancouver, off of Clark Street.

Glynis Tao

Great. So I love to get to know you a little bit better. So let's go back to the beginning. Can you tell us about your background and how you got into this business?

Okay, yes.

Shannon

Before or like my last life, I was a teacher and I befriended one of the parents in my class and I loved her and she has three kids and just like, I actually just kind of wanted to be her to be honest. And she ran, she started Simply Merino. So she started it in 2010. Her husband is from New Zealand and her mother-in-law is a Merino wool supplier.

She talked to me about her business and I loved it. Fast forward a year, I had a kid and then we were hanging out and I just asked her how her business was. And to me from the outside, it looked easy. It looked like she had everything put together. She was easy breezy. And she's like, well, I can't do it anymore. I have to close the doors. It's just too much for me. There's too much going on. And I just can't do it.

And so I talked to my partner and I was like, oh, you know, like this would be fun. He's an engineer at the time. I think he was doing his MBA and just really go, it'd be fun thing to do. So I asked her and I approached her and I was like, Hey, like, do you, do you want to see it go somewhere? Or do you want to just close the doors? And she's like, I would love for someone to take it. And like someone who I love and trust.

So we bought her inventory and at the time it was just babies and pajamas and thermals and very small, all made in New Zealand. So that's how it started. So that was nine years ago. There's been many years of learning experiences, many tears. It was great. It was a great thing not to have started it from the ground up.

It was also very hard in the same way because I already had some customers, not many, but they had this expectation and I just, I honestly had no idea what I was doing and had to learn from all of my mistakes. But that's where it started and nine years ago and it's been growing every year and I'm very fortunate and I fell into this, but it's my passion and it's just been a really great journey.

Glynis Tao

Wow, that's amazing. That's a great story. So no background in business or fashion.

Shannon

You know, the more women that I meet who are small business owners, they don't have much business background either. It's just the passion that comes with it. And I was always an environmentalist and I got my degree in geography and just like really that was my passion. And I think because of that, that's really helped our business succeed and it wasn't about the money.

Does that make, like, it was more kind of like, this would be a fun thing to do, never expecting that it would be my full-time job and I don't teach anymore. But yes, no fashion, although I did make my grad dress when I was in grade 12. So there's that. I have some fashion.

Glynis Tao

There you go. That's great. I think really having that passion is a really important factor, right? In any business, I think you can learn all those other aspects, but the passion really carries you through the hard times and the challenges. So how did your own lifestyle, whether as a parent, a creative or a conscious consumer, shape your vision for the brand.

Shannon

Well, so I had my firstborn who was one at the time and I guess it was just well and then I had my second one a year or two after and that it yes it was important for my kids to wear natural fibers and understanding the health impacts of non-natural fabrics and synthetics were extremely important to me always. And having kids, it was even more important. But that was kind of like the drive of the beginning of the business of the natural fabric for kids. Then understanding that my customers also, the moms also wanted something and therefore I wanted something. Like the balance was hard. Everything was just, I don't really know how to answer the question.

The lifestyle, I guess it's, yeah, I'm always an outdoorsy person. I'm always a natural person. I did my holistic health practitioner course and lived on Salt Springs. So that has always been important to me. And that is true in our brand as well. And then it's like the natural colors and the beauty of the wool that is enhanced and not necessarily the styles.

Glynis Tao

Yeah. I can really see that come through in your branding aesthetic and your color palette. A lot of the nature natural colors. Why did you choose Merino Wall specifically? Because I know you took over your friend's business and they are already working with a New Zealand wall, did you say? So what really drew you to that fabric over others?

Shannon

It was just the properties. I knew Merino wool before with the bigger companies and loved it and understood it. And it was just the amazing qualities that it has, like the hypoallergenic, fire resistant, natural, wicking. The list goes on and the fact that it's renewable, it's natural.

That always intrigued me, but the business started with Merino wool. I can't pivot and say, okay, now we're gonna only make things in cotton where it's like 90% cheaper, which would be good with the financials, but it was always the heart of the brand.

Then understanding it more, we went to visit Australia and our supply chain and Merino sheep farms and like understanding the work that goes into it, the love that goes into it, the stories that are into it just inspires me more to work with the fabric.

It's such a beautiful fabric. Beautiful.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, I mean, your fabric is really, it's, you use mostly knits, right? Knit fabrics and it looks so soft, you know, it's so comfortable compared to what you normally think of when you think of wool, kind of that maybe itchy, scratchy kind of feeling, but your clothes don't look like that at all.

Shannon

It's not. Sometimes, you know, there are a small percentage of people who can't wear it no matter if it's really soft or not. But I'd say like 99% of our customers. Yeah, it's it's so soft and it's easy to wear. And it's just because of the microns are so low, which means it's just like a really soft fiber as opposed to wool from other sheep. Merino sheep just have really fine fibers.

Glynis Tao

Simply Merino is known for its quality, transparency, and sustainability. How do those values show up in your design and production process?

Shannon

Well, we try to be as transparent as we can. Design wise, well, I always kind of go with what my customers and followers want to see. It's over the nine years of learning social media, because I had no idea what I was doing. People want to see who's behind the brand.

People wanna know what we do, where we have our products made, who makes them, how we design products. But I really try to get my customers involved. For example, a lot of our newer products, it's because people wanted them. If a lot of people are asking for a certain item, then I take them on the journey of trying to make the item that they want, right?

So it's always been important, it was never at the beginning of the business. I felt like I had to hide everything because we were so small. You know, like we were working out of our bedroom and then our garage. And it just was, for some reason I felt embarrassed because you follow people on Instagram and everything is perfect and they have the most perfect showroom and just like, I wasn't there and I wasn't transparent in that.

In those days, I wasn't with our business per se, but like, it wasn't until recently that I felt like it was so, it's so important to tell the whole story, you know? But that's what the feedback that I've got from the people who are our customers. So it was a learning experience for how much they want to see, how much transparency they want to see.

Glynis Tao

Hmm, okay. So from what you're saying, it sounds like you involve your customers in the process of the designing and production parts and taking their feedback and turning them into garments. Your pieces are beautiful and simple and functional. So how do you approach your product development for everyday essentials and what makes a garment worth producing?

Shannon

Great question. someone told me this a while ago. I can't remember who and I can't remember how long ago, but they're like, you need to make something that fits you well, that you love. Not everyone will love it. The fit won't work for everyone, but hopefully some people will. Hopefully like quite a few people will, right? So I never make anything that I wouldn't wear. You know, if a customer wants something like a tube top or something like that, I'm not gonna make it, you know, especially if I think that it won't work and I wouldn't wear it. So I do take into account what my customers want, but at the end of the day, I need to make something that I love with the colors that I love, with the different types of fabric that I love. So, as long as I trust myself and I am honest, then I think that I'm making a good product. And if I do make a sample that I hate, I'm not going to make it. You know?

Glynis Tao

So you're like the final decision judge that says whether or not this is going to go through or not.

Shannon

100% and it's just me. I'm designing it. I'm getting it made. I'm trying it on. 

Glynis Tao

And it's nice to have a business like that where you're making something that you also love yourself, right?

Shannon

Yes. I wear my brand all the time.

Glynis Tao

That's amazing. So you do all your production in Vancouver, Canada. Yes. Has it been challenging to keep your productions, products Canadian made and has there been a renewed interest in making Canada products since the tariffs have been announced?

Shannon

No, it's never been an issue making anything in Canada. Vancouver has so many skilled seamstresses and manufacturers. I know right now there's a lot of manufacturers that don't have enough business because a lot of the American companies said no to Canadian made and they're out. So it's a really great time for Canadian apparel businesses to start making or thinking about making in Canada. But no, you know, it took a few years to find ones that we love. We've been working with the same three for, I don't know, five, six years. So they're our friends. know, if there's something wrong with, you know, there's always going to be some quality controls and if there's a seam that's wrong or it's like uneven, it's so easy for us to get in the car and they fix them, you know, without like, there's not even any hesitation because we have that relationship and because it's there, we're local.

Yes, there has been more interest in Canadian made, but that was, you know, when COVID started, everyone wanted to support local. Everyone wanted Canadian made, which was great. COVID actually really helped our business because everyone wanted to be outside and then they understood Merino wool and supporting small Canadian businesses. So yeah, that time was great for us. And again, right now, because of the tariffs in February, when there is a lot of fear regarding the tariffs, we had great sales, but will it last? I'm not sure, but I'm really glad that Canada or Canadian brands are being showcased and understanding the importance of Canadian made. And it's not as hard as one would think.

Glynis Tao

Great. So you recently took a trip to see your Australian wool supplier. Can you tell us a little bit about that? Sort of what you saw, what learned?

Shannon

Yeah, well, we took our kids and it was a family trip and we've always been kind of working with it. We've been working with the same supplier and through emails and perhaps some phone calls. But on our end, we're thinking that they're a huge supplier and, you know, intimidating and coming from our little small shop. So we really want to understand them. We want to build that relationship. But also understand the process of processing Merino wool. So we went down there, we met our supplier in just out of Melbourne and it was so lovely. It's such a small facility. You know, it was funny because like you have these grandiose ideas and then you walk in and everyone knows your name and just like, it was just so interesting to understand how they knit and dye and what they're doing for sustainability. And it was just a really great experience and for our kids to understand like this is where our wool comes from. Also, we got to visit one of many Merino farms, but especially one that our wool actually came from. So we go there and

We stayed there overnight and it was just the most beautiful experience. The farm was incredibly beautiful and it's just so magical. And they were so excited to see a final product. They've never seen anything that would come from their sheep. So we got to show them and give them some of our product from their farm.

It was just so magical. It's hard to kind of put into words how important it was for me, just the passion and the understanding of the transparency is just, it was so great. I want to go back, but probably not for a few years. It was so great though.

Glynis Tao

Oh, that sounds amazing. Just to meet the people face to face. People grow your fibers, raw material, right? It's starting point.

Shannon

It's starting point and how many businesses are able to do that, right? Like we shook hands with the farmers who sheared the sheep to make it. It is just, it's just so special, so special.

Glynis Tao

This reminds me of a documentary I saw. Have you seen it? It's called Fashion Reimagine.

Shannon

I don't know if I have.

Glynis Tao

My gosh. It's a great film. It's documentary that follows. It's a UK brand, Mother Pearl. They're a creative director, designer, and they wanted to have the same thing, right? Full transparency with their supply chain where they source their materials. they were going to sourcing for wool and cotton. So, yeah, the whole documentary takes them along the journey.

They wanted to know exactly where the wool was coming from and the farmers and then, you know, the whole knitting process and everything, right, along the whole supply chain. It's a great film. think you would love it.

A lot of customers today are seeking out sustainable options. So how do you educate your audience about the benefits of Merino and the ethics behind your brand?

Shannon

While I try to put as much information on our website, we've got quite a few different pages that talk about the sustainability practices of our shop and the supply chain and so forth, but also social media, a bit of a broken record of the wrongdoings of fast fashion and not necessarily just talking about my brand, but how it's important to choose quality over costs perhaps or like knowing where your product comes from and who makes them and what it actually means. mostly it's social media to be honest. And again, it's like the kind of the question answer if whatever people want to hear, I try to explain and educate. But it's this constant thing because, you know, social media it's like three weeks later I have to do it again because there's different people who see it or didn't see it.

But it's my job, I feel, to educate customers or potential customers the importance and again, not only my shop, but to understand what they're buying and who they're buying from just to make sure that they feel good. I know that so many people don't have the means really to buy slow fashion or educate themselves on the importance. And if my customers are choosing my shop to buy something from me, when I know most people are financially in a hard time, that fills my heart and it makes me understand the importance of what they want. You know, like they want to know who they're buying from. And I'm honored that they're buying from us.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, that must feel really good and reassuring, guess, to have the feeling that your customers understand and appreciate what you do.

Shannon

Yeah, 100%. Seeing so like, really don't know what I'm doing, you know? I'm trying, like I'm figuring it out, but I really, I'm just, I don't really know what I'm doing.

Glynis Tao

Well, let me ask you this question. What has your community of customers taught you throughout this journey or inspired you to do differently?

Shannon

To be honest, I feel so grateful for my community of customers because they've really embraced me and seem to appreciate me and what I do and what I make and how we make it and how transparent we are and that we're trying. And I think the bottom line is that our customers know that we're trying to be a better business, a sustainable, like we care. I think they've just taught me to follow my heart, that's what it is. To follow my heart because for so long I just kind of, for the first three or four years of owning this business and working so hard and just crying at nighttime because it was just me and.

I kept saying that I was a teacher, but I hadn't taught for three years because I wasn't, I never felt worthy of the label that I'm an entrepreneur or a business owner. I never felt like that. I still am like, no, you know what? No, I am proud now and I'm able to say it, but that's because of my community of customers who have taught me to be proud. You know? They're important.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, absolutely. And this is a good segue to lead me into the next question about, okay, challenges and lessons learned. What were some of the biggest challenges you faced early on as a business owner?

Shannon

Well, like I said, we had no idea what we were doing. And in this industry, I think it's different now, but everyone was very hush-hush of where they would make their garments, right? Like no one would say where they would make them because they didn't want anyone else to come in and take over their space. So it was so hard to find a manufacturer. And the first manufacturer we had did not go well, had the wrong machine and basically, like I said, I already had some customers, so they were waiting on our restock of the products that have already been made and she had used the wrong machine, so when you put it on, it stretched and the threads broke and I didn't know what, like we didn't have a lot of money and customers were upset.

But I didn't refund them. I didn't know what I was doing. I was like, okay, well, sorry, this is what happened. If you want to fix it, we'll pay to get it fixed. Or I can't remember what we did, but I wasn't, I didn't do that well. I felt like it was our error. What we should have done was just like, you know, scrapped it all and then just started fresh. But I still feel bad for that because those customers walked away with, you know, not so great product.

As well as like, I had two small kids and I, it was incredibly hard. The balance for women, I'm sure there's balance for men as well, but I would resent my baby for not sleeping because I had to count stock. I had to fill orders. I had to, I would get mad at her for not sleeping right away at nighttime and I, I've, it hurts my heart because it was such a hard time. Cause I couldn't figure it out and I felt like I had to do everything right away in order for our business to grow. Now, you know, nine years later, I have a lot more spare time because I would, I'm able to, have some employees that help me. When you start out a new business, you have no help financially. You have no finances. And with kids, it was really hard.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, so you had a baby already, right? When you had taken over the business and then you had your second child too. How old are your kids now?

Shannon

10, almost 11 and almost 8.

Shannon

Yeah, it's good times now and it's fun for them to see our business now. But I almost think like it would have been easier if I started something now rather than when they were really little when they depended on you so much, right? Yeah, it's hard.

Glynis Tao

And this is a family business, Is your husband involved in it as well?

Shannon

Yeah, we own it 100% and then we have a few employees that help with packing orders and customer service, but that's it. So it's just us. And now, you know, when we first, the first few years, I'd never say that like, oh, we're a big business. I never would say a big business, you know, it was, I was embarrassed that it was just us.

Glynis Tao

My gosh, I have to show you this post that I made on Instagram about the same thing because I had a clothing brand before. You know, those early days when I was cutting and sewing, making everything myself on my kitchen table, I was hiding behind it and saying, pretending that I was like this large corporation. You know?

Shannon

Yeah, I know had this facade right and just kind of hid behind the products and I don't know if storytelling was a big deal back then, right? Right now it is. Yeah, it's funny how we felt ashamed of working hard in our kitchen table. I still work on my kitchen table, by the way. That's my office.

Glynis Tao

There's nothing wrong with that. That's great. you should show us more of that behind the scenes. I'd love to see it.

So let's move on to talking about growth. What were some pivotal moments that helped Simply Merino grow from an idea into a successful business?

Shannon

It was a slow growth, you know, we've been growing every year to a really great pace for us. Like I said, we're very small. We have no intention of becoming this big company. don't think being bigger means better, right? Like there comes more problems and I just that is not of interest to me.

To be honest, COVID really helped us. Like that was a pivotal moment where we were sought after in a way, right? Like we ticked off quite a few check marks for what Canadians wanted at the time. So we were very fortunate to get a big boost of sales during that time. And it was organic growth and then certain people found our shop and organically shared it. And I felt like that was part of a lot of our growth too. When bigger names tend to share something, people listen. So we had a few great people who, again, just shared our shop and helped us grow in that. And then I think that was our biggest growth during the first year and a year and a half of COVID. And then it's been growing since, but I felt like that was like a big push.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, and I think, I mean, we talked a little bit about educating consumer. Just in terms of like the brand itself and building awareness and trust for a, I guess a lesser known, let's common fabric like Merino wool. Yeah, how did you build this awareness, especially in the Canadian market?

Shannon

Gosh, um, I don't really know. I don't think it was me. I don't think I did anything different. I felt like maybe I pushed more of the the properties of Merino wool and why it was important for that time of our life, but I honestly think I don't think it was much about me. I think it was other people who shared about us and educated their followers or customers or whomever. But I don't think it was entirely me.

Glynis Tao

Right. Yeah, no, that's really interesting. You say that. do you like, I'm just curious to know, I guess from a more business standpoint, a point of view, right? Because the podcast is really more intended for fashion printers and business owners. just your sort of insight on all this. So like what marketing or customer strategies helped you to create the loyalty for your brand and getting those repeat customers?

Shannon

Great question. Well, we've really never paid for any marketing. So Google AdWords we did for a year, I think, but we don't invest in a lot of marketing. Again, like I didn't have a strategy by any means. There's just by chance certain groups, so a lot of different groups like natural fabrics and when our shop is featured in these groups such as like homesteading families. Homestead is huge right now. So that's farms and you know natural lifestyles. It's huge. We gained so many new customers but I didn't know about that community, right?

So it wasn't, I wasn't searching for different ways of marketing. It kind of organically just happened. So these different communities and groups shared us and then I understood, wow, these outdoor communities really want wool. I'm going to market that or like hashtag outdoor or

work with outdoor schools, which we've done many times, right? So I didn't have a strategy. It was all kind of like what I experienced and then I followed through from that. Does that make sense?

Glynis Tao

That's really interesting. I think every company does things differently. Yeah. It's interesting that you share that and these communities that you just happen to, I guess, come across that you didn't know before.

Shannon

No, you know, obviously I knew that but I didn't know that how much interest they wanted or invested in natural fabrics, right? And I was like, So it was by chance. But I don't think it's for every fabric. If this is for, you know, fashion students or fashion businesses, it's not for every fabric. But I think it's listening and understanding where the need is or your niche market, right? And then kind of market it through that.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, very good advice. I love it. So let's talk about the future. How has your brand and your vision evolved over the years? I mean, from the beginning, when you first started to where you are now, how has your vision for the brand evolved?

Shannon

Well, like I said, it started just as kids because, you know what, 10 plus years ago it was very hard to find any pajamas that weren't chemically treated with fire retardants and Merino wool is naturally fire resistant. So the brand focused on kids and still does. But when I started making, first I made a long sleeve shirt for women.

And then it kind of just naturally just progressed into more of a women centered brand. And again, it's kind of like what people were wanting. You know, there's the basics for kids, but you can't really go too much more with the kids line. But for women, there's so many different products that you could make

And to be honest, it's more inspiring for me because then I, like kids, yes, of course it's important. They are important, but these I get to have like different styles and different fabrics. That's been exciting too. I've really, I've been more using different types of weaves. So like waffle and fleece and a thicker rib. That's really exciting. That really helped. Kind of like my inspiration for the brand.

Glynis Tao

Do you have any new product, collaborations, goals on horizon?

Shannon

Okay, yes, so I'm bringing out new products, not all the time, just the products that I feel are worthy of making and the need for them. I'm making some men's underwear, because our Merino underwear for women is one of our biggest selling products. And I have a little boy and he needs some wool underwear, so I'm making those. So kind of like making a bit more for men, not much. I really am more focused on women and a few items for men and obviously kids. 

So we've saved over 15,000 pounds of our textile waste in production and last summer we shipped it on a train to North Carolina where they are recycling it. So our next big project is making products out of our recycled wool. So that is like, that's my excitement for the next probably year. So yeah, that's the, and the goal, the goal is just to keep doing what I'm doing and not focus on numbers per se, but just focus on my true self and what my values are for our brand.

Glynis Tao

That sounds amazing. So the scraps that got sent down to North Carolina, did you say, are actually going to be repurposed into something else like turned into another fiber that you're going to use?

Shannon

Yeah, so they are shredding it and they have already shredded it and now they are just testing what kind of thread or yarn that they can make it into. So they would have to add either virgin wool with it to make it stronger or not, or maybe cotton or something. And then we're going to see what we can make.

It's kind of a testing period, but yes, it's going to become wool again, not necessarily a fabric, like a knitted something or other, know, socks and hats and maybe a sweater and a blanket, but all from our recycled textile waste. I know, I know. So that's what I'm really looking forward to for sure.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, wow. So last question. So what advice would you give to other women or mompreneurs starting their own sustainable fashion brand or starting their own sustainable fashion brand?

Shannon

I would say go for it and don't be afraid of storytelling. Be transparent. Stay true to your values and what is important to your brand, whether it's design or the fabric. But if you're a true sustainable fashion brand, then you have to work hard and you have to earn that title.

You know? So, as long as you have a passion and you have a drive, then do it. It's hard, but you gotta do it. You gotta try.

Glynis Tao

Yes, you gotta try. Yeah, no, I mean, I really feel what you're saying. Just really, it truly comes from the heart. I can feel it. 

Shannon

I think that if you're doing it just for the money, don't do it.

Glynis Tao

No, don't do it. It's not a business to get into to get rich fast.

Shannon

Exactly. It was you know, five years. It took us five years to even make any money. Right? Don't do it for money because it's likely it's not going to happen. But if you're doing it to make a change and to do it to do something better, then yes, of course, do it.

Glynis Tao

Where can people find you if they want to get in touch with you?

Shannon

I would say email or social media. I'm the one behind social media, so any messages go to me. My email address, shannon@simplymarino.com. Those are the two best ways to get a hold of me.

Glynis Tao

Thank you so much, Shannon, for sharing your journey, insights, and inspiration with us today.

Shannon

Thanks for having me. That was so fun.

Glynis Tao

That was great. If you're listening and want to experience the comfort of sustainable Merino wool for yourself, head to simplymerino.ca.

Pricing Strategies for Product Success: How to Price Your Products Profitably

by Glynis Tao | Dec 12, 2024 | Podcast

In this episode, James Friedrich, owner of Ambler Mountain Works and founder of Venturing Up, talks about pricing strategies for entrepreneurs. Drawing from his extensive experience managing a $60 million product portfolio at MEC and his own entrepreneurial journey, James explains how to set prices based on your products’ values and avoid common pricing mistakes in order to maximize profit.

James introduces the Pricing for Profit methodology taught in his free email course. He also provides examples of well-known brands that use value-based pricing to illustrate how companies could potentially charge more for their products.

Whether you’re a fashion brand owner launching a product or looking to create healthier margins on your products, James’ advice will help you to price confidently, attract ideal customers, and build a thriving, standout brand.

About James Friedrich

James Friedrich is the owner of Ambler Mountain Works and Venturing Up. He was formerly a senior merchant at MEC where he ran a successful $60 million product portfolio. He started his career as an entrepreneur and his goal with Venturing Up is to provide entrepreneurs with the knowledge, mentorship and community he wished he had when he started out many years ago. 

Contact info

Email: james@amblermountainworks.com

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jamesfriedrich/

Website: https://venturingup.com/

Free Pricing for Profit Email Course: https://venturingup.com/free-course

Takeaways

• Focus on the unique value your product provides to set prices that align with what your customers are willing to pay.
• Narrow your target to a specific audience with clear needs to improve customer engagement and justify higher pricing.
• Clearly communicate the benefits and features that make your product worth the price.
• Conduct your own research to avoid relying on competitor pricing that may not reflect your product’s true value.
• Experiment with pricing changes periodically and use sales and margin data to refine your strategy.
• Maintain healthy cash flow by pricing your products to ensure strong margins and efficient inventory turnover.
• Revisit your pricing regularly to stay competitive and ensure profitability over time.

Interview themes

What is value-based pricing?

Value-based pricing is a method where a company sets its product or service prices based on the perceived value to the customer rather than solely on production costs or competitor prices. This approach aligns prices with customer perceptions, ensuring that businesses maximize their profitability while delivering products that customers feel are worth the price. Value-based pricing requires a deep understanding of customer needs, preferences, and the unique benefits that the offering provides.

Through Venturing Up, James provides a free Pricing for Profit email course that is a step-by-step process based on value-based pricing. It teaches entrepreneurs to evaluate, test, and refine their pricing strategies to achieve profitability and sustainable growth.

What are the benefits of value-based pricing?

Increased profit margins: By pricing products based on their value to customers, businesses can charge more than cost-plus or what market-based methods typically allow. This leads to higher profit margins.

Stronger customer loyalty: Customers are more likely to stay loyal to a brand when they feel they’re receiving value that justifies the price. This builds trust and long-term relationships.

Differentiation from competitors: Value-based pricing highlights the unique benefits and features of a product, making it stand out in a crowded market.

What are some examples of brands that use value-based pricing?

James Friedrich highlights Yeti as a prime example of value-based pricing. Yeti disrupted a market of $50 coolers by offering products priced three to five times higher, focusing on premium features like extended ice retention and unmatched durability. By redefining the cooler category and building a high-end lifestyle brand, Yeti demonstrated that customers willingly pay more for exceptional value, driving the company to billion-dollar success.

Apple is another brand that James mentions as an example of using value-based pricing. Apple dominates its categories with products consistently priced higher than competitors by focusing on performance features customers care about—sleek design, intuitive usability, and status appeal. Rather than competing on cost, Apple builds products that justify their premium price through unmatched customer experience and perceived value.

How do you know if your pricing is working?

Success is not just about how many units you sell—it’s about profitability and sustainability. Business owners should measure metrics such as:

Profit margins: Are you earning enough to cover all business expenses and reinvest in growth?

Sales trends: Are your sales growing or stagnating?

Inventory turnover: Are products selling quickly enough to maintain healthy cash flow?

James suggests periodic price testing. For instance, raise your price slightly for a set period and compare revenue and sales performance to a baseline.

What are some common pricing mistakes?

Copycat pricing: Assuming competitors have done their homework can lead you to set prices that don’t reflect your product’s value. For example, if everyone else is pricing similar products at $20, that doesn’t mean your unique features can’t command $30 or more.

Undervaluing your work: Entrepreneurs often let fear or self-doubt lead to underpricing. This mindset can hurt your margins and make it impossible to scale.

Overbuilt products without value alignment: If you add costs to your product that the market doesn’t value (e.g., unnecessary features), you’ll struggle to achieve healthy margins.

How could selling lower volumes at a higher price point be beneficial?

James explains that selling lower volumes at a higher price is not always a bad thing. Increased pricing boosts margins, which could offset a drop in sales volume. He advises entrepreneurs to focus on overall profitability rather than sales numbers alone. Raising prices while delivering strong value increases margins and improves cash flow, which supports long-term growth.

What does it mean to niche and increase?

According to James, “niche and increase” means to identify and target a specific audience whose needs align with your product’s unique features. This helps differentiate your brand in the marketplace and allows you to increase prices by delivering tailored value. For example, a pediatric dentist can charge more than a general dentist by addressing specific needs for children. This targeted strategy enhances perceived value, justifies premium pricing, and builds stronger customer loyalty and market presence.

Chapters

00:00 Value-Based Pricing: Understanding Consumer Perception

01:51 James Friedrich's Journey: From Merchant to Entrepreneur

08:31 Lessons from Failure: The Birth of Venturing Up

15:46 Pricing for Profit: Strategies for Entrepreneurs

20:54 The Value Equation: Aligning Price with Perceived Value

28:57 Niche Targeting: The Key to Successful Marketing

33:43 Testing Pricing Strategies: Metrics and Adjustments

39:56 The Psychological Aspect of Pricing: Overcoming Fear

43:36 Future Goals: Expanding Ambler Mountain Works

Transcript

Glynis Tao

Welcome to Chase Your Dreams, a podcast for fashion entrepreneurs who want to build a purposeful and profitable clothing business so they can make a living doing what they love. I'm your host, Glynis Tao, an apparel business consultant and SEO specialist with 20 years apparel industry experience. I'm also a mom to a wonderfully energetic little boy named Chase.

James Friedrich is the owner of Ambler Mountain Works and Venturing Up. He was formerly a senior merchant at MEC where he ran a successful $60 million product portfolio. He started his career as an entrepreneur and his goal with Venturing Up is to provide entrepreneurs with the knowledge, mentorship and community he wished he had when he started out many years ago. 

Welcome James, it's so nice to have you here today. Thanks for joining me on the podcast.

James Friedrich

Thank you, Glynis. I'm super stoked to be here and excited to be talking to you.

Glynis Tao

Amazing. I mean, there's been a few changes that happened the last little while. I just want to get caught up here. I know about your background a little bit that you were working at MEC as a senior merchant there for about seven years?

James

Seven years.

Glynis Tao

Wow. Yeah.

And then most recently you decided to step into entrepreneurship and become the owner of Ambler Mountain Works. So that's really exciting. I think I want to touch a little bit on that in this interview. But can you just tell us a little bit about your background and how you first got into product world?

James

Yeah, for sure. And I think the story of my background is actually kind of also parlays into why I ultimately acquired Ambler Mountain Works. But I'll start at the beginning. And so my journey and product really began for me probably when I was around like 12 or 13 years old. And this was in the early to mid nineties. I'm dating myself by saying, by giving the years here. And at the time I was really into skateboarding and the trend in skateboarding was baggy pants, super, super baggy pants. At the time you couldn't buy those baggy pants. I have to buy oversized pants. You know, like I was wearing like size, like 38 pants as a 12 year old. And so I wanted to be able, so I had this thought in my mind where I was thinking, I want these baggy pants, but I want this gigantic waist. Maybe I can modify a pair of pants or do something to kind of get these, these really baggy pants I was looking for. So what I ended up doing was cutting open the inseam on a pair of existing pants. And sewing in a strip of material to turn them into, turn them into another, like a super baggy pair of pants. And that they turned it, they turned out awful. You know, it was a, I didn't know how to use a sewing machine or anything like that. But ultimately I could wear them. And that was just something about that was so inspiring and exciting that I could kind of like take and create, or in this case, modify something to, into what I was looking for. That it kind of started me down the path of getting into products. And I kept going from there.

I kept making more clothes and eventually kind of throughout my high school careers, I really got into designing and sewing clothes. I made all my own jeans. was dyeing denim. And I ultimately also figured out how to, you know, buy small amounts of like Gore-Tex and I got into outerwear, doing seam sealing and all these things kind of at home and really got into apparel and clothing design from probably about 12 years old to 17 or 18 years old.

And then my passion for snowboarding kind of kicked in and I, and I went off to the mountains and did a couple of years of snowboarding. And when I came back from, from the mountains, I wanted to be able to kind of continue to work in my passion of snowboarding. At the same time I, as I had gone to, into university and I was at the time studying engineering, I said, okay, how can I blend this like passion for snowboarding and this kind of love of like creating things.

And ultimately I thought, hey, you know what, I'm going to try and build a snowboard. And I took on this project of kind of building and constructing a snowboard. again, kind of like the, kind of like the, what I was telling you earlier about the super baggy pants. I took on this project and I was able to find materials and figure out how as a person as a hobbyist, you can actually build and construct your own snowboard. And that's what I did. Again, it wasn't perfect. There were a lot of issues with it, but it was so inspiring to me that I could build something I could go out and ride. And then I was blending this passion, this passion for snowboarding with some of my technical background that I continued to build more and more snowboards.

And ultimately when I graduated from university together with a close friend, we launched our own snowboard company. So we designed and manufactured snowboards and sold them throughout Western Canada, both direct to consumer and through wholesalers under the brand name Class 5 Snowboards. And that was a really cool experience. Ultimately, that business, that company, Class Five Snowboards, I put my heart and soul into it, but ultimately it wasn't successful.

And that experience of kind of putting all your energy and time and money into something and having it not turn out, was just a, just this huge blow to me. And it took me a long time to kind of like recover from that. But ultimately that's, you know, kind of fast forward to where I am right now and acquiring Ambler. That's ultimately what drove me to do that and the work I do at Venturing Up. My mission, kind of like a dual mission here, is that the pain that I experienced through that failure, I want to help as many people as possible avoid that pain in their own lives. At the same time as building a successful business, building and growing a successful business and using that business and the experience that I have in that business to be able to help other people. So ultimately that's why I've kind of come to, you know, come to acquire Ambler and super excited to be working in Ambler. It's because it just aligns with that long-term mission that I've had. And that's where, know, my roundabout way of kind of telling you why I'm here today as the owner of Ambler.

Glynis Tao

Yeah. Thank you for sharing that story. And I think I knew a little bit about that because I think you shared it during your talk at Apparel Camp.

James Friedrich

Yes.

Glynis Tao

Sort of where I think we first met and I heard your talk and speaking about your experience with how you've managed such a huge project portfolio and all your experience with that. I was like, this is really incredible. That's kind of what sparked me to want to reach out to you and talk about it more. And also because you have both that corporate experience working for a big brand. cause I also saw that you worked at Mustang Survival.

James Friedrich

Yeah, that's right. So when things kind of were wrapping up with Class Five, I was looking kind of like, okay, I'm looking where would I go next? And I found this company in Vancouver, Mustang Survival. And it just seemed like at the time a perfect fit for me because they were making very technical products, but they were apparel based products. So we were making, you know, life saving equipment that was made from apparel. it kind of blended this background that I had of, you know, designing and making my own clothes, but also this engineering and technical engineering background I had. So I got a job there as a product development engineer, bringing, you know, designing and running new product development projects and bringing new products to market. And that was just such a wonderful experience working for that company.

There was so much, so much learning that happened there. But the one question that I would always kind of like sit in the back of my mind was we would technically be able to execute on a product, like design and create a product where it would meet the product specifications. But that didn't necessarily mean that the product was going to be successful in the marketplace. So just because we could technically design something didn't mean commercially it was going to be successful. And that kind of exploring that question along with the passion that I had mentioned earlier around the, you know, that pain of helping other entrepreneurs kind of kept pushing me to look at what's further up the chain. What are the inputs that come into product development projects? How do we create products that are successful? And I moved from being a product development engineer into being the commercial product manager for Mustang. So I managed the recreational product portfolio, all of our sailing, fishing, and general recreational products that you would find through retailers.

And that was such a great exposure into dealing with, you know, retail buyers. At the time our big accounts were people like Bass Pro in the U S Cabela's in the US, those people who are familiar with boating. There's a big company called West Marine that has like, think 180 doors in the US something along those lines. So dealing with these large retailers, especialty retailers as a product manager was so just, just really unlocked this whole new world of sitting between developing product, working with their sales teams and understanding what these large retailers want.

That whole experience at Mustang was just like, there was just so many positives and so much learning I took out of my time there that kind of informed me and helped me as I've been, you know, in the various stages, other things I've done throughout my career.

Glynis Tao

That stepping stone towards becoming a senior merchant at MEC, which was your next role. And then, like just kind of going through your journey of how you became a senior merchant at MEC to founding Venturing Up and then now becoming the owner of Ambler Mountain Works. I think now this like, you know, explains a little bit better and I think I have better understanding of what was going on. I think your why or your reason was always wanting to help other people, to avoid the pain that you had went through when you had first started your business, right? Classified snowboards and anything that was, so that was always that driving force, right? Behind everything that you did.

James Friedrich

Yeah, there was always some part of that was just there because that pain, the pain was deep. So it was always kind of in the back of my mind and when I left Mustang to join MEC and become a merchant, it was just kind of a dream come true in some ways. Working for MEC had always been something that I had in the back of my mind. I just, I really loved the values based organization. I loved the products that the company dealt with. I loved at the time it was a co-op and I loved the co-op structure. And so being able to like move into MEC and get a job as a merchant was incredible.

The cool thing for me that I found and the insight that I was able to gain from MEC, when you're working within a brand or within your own company, you're kind of just, you're a little bit siloed. You get to see what other brands or companies are putting out there in their marketing or what's on display on the store shelves of various retailers. But you don't quite know what's happening behind the scenes. Like how is one brand performing against another brand?

What's the standard in the industry and the cool part about working for that I found about working for a company like MEC is you really got that behind the scenes look. And I got to deal with hundreds and hundreds of companies and over my career, thousands and thousands of products. And you get to see, what's working and what's not working and what brands kind of have everything together and both outwardly and inwardly or vice versa. And it was, it was just such a, you know, this breadth of experience that I got to gain from  that, that I don't know how you'd be able to get an experience like that elsewhere because you're not going to get exposed to all those behind the scenes numbers. Like, this brand, they're crushing it, but nobody even knows them. They're just like, they're a small brand and they're just doing so well. They're not even on the radar for everyone else.

Or this big brand that everyone thinks is amazing. Actually they suck in all these areas and you don't get that insight because you can't see behind the curtain. And being able to kind of experience that firsthand with MEC was awesome. And it really provided me with a lot of insight that ultimately led to why I started Venturing Up. Cause I was reflecting on my career and that pain from Class Five and and now with this breadth of experience in a lot of different areas. I was like, you know, maybe there's a way I can kind of like be involved with entrepreneurs now and help them, help them in some way, which is, I think it was like two-ish years ago that I started Venturing Up and alongside working at MEC and consulting with startup engineers, startup entrepreneurs to help them kind of like launch and grow their, launch and grow their product businesses.

Glynis Tao

How did your experience managing a $60 million product portfolio at MEC influence the methodology that you teach in your free email course, Pricing for Profit? Actually, by the way, you can access James's course, Pricing for Profit, on your website, VenturingUp.com/free course, right? So I just wanted to spend a little bit of time talking about that and just sort of how your experience sort of played into your role in helping entrepreneurs and Venturing Up.

James Friedrich

Sure. Yeah. And as it relates to the pricing, like, you know, what I saw is, and I think a lot of people have experienced this too. When you're in a product business, you know, the price of your product, the cost of your product, and ultimately the price of your product, the difference between those two being your margin. That's what, that has to pay for everything that you do in your business. That's all your profits. That's all the, you know, non-product related expenses.

Everything that happens in your business is based on your margin. So your price is really, really important because it's ultimately what's going to define your profitability and the potential for your products to sell. As you know, having worked on so many products, I've seen every pricing strategy out there and I've seen it be successful for one reason or another, and also not be successful for other reasons.

And what I want to be able to do with the Pricing for Profit email course was to be able to address the common challenges that I saw with small entrepreneurs as it relates to pricing. And the first thing that we want to be aware of is that entrepreneurs can sometimes feel that their cost is too high and that they, because they're not getting any economies of scale.

Often as a startup business, you're kind of just squeaking in, you're getting the minimum order quantity from a factory or on a, with a supplier or a trim or something like that. And you're kind of, your costs are always, your product costs are always at kind of the highest they're going to be when you're starting out because you have no volume to put behind those product costs. So a lot of times people felt, and I certainly felt it too, that my margin was getting squeezed because of my costing.

And that's, that's true to some degree, but what I wanted to shine a light on with Pricing for Profit is how much opportunity there is for you as a small entrepreneur to get it right on your pricing. And you know, the way I like to think about it is like, you can spend three or four months trying to reduce your product costs by a few dollars, or you can spend like five or 10 minutes increasing your price by that same amount. And the leverage that you get on pricing, the return on investment and turn on time you get from pricing just can't be matched.

But you can't just go around changing your prices to whatever you want just because you feel like it. So with Pricing for Profit, we provide a step-by-step system, a systematic process that you can go through to really evaluate how your product creates value in the marketplace and to set a price that provides you profit. But also your customers and the people who buy your product are going to see it as being valuable and ultimately purchase your purchase product.

So that's what, that was just a huge leverage point that I saw a lot of entrepreneurs struggling with. So yeah, you can, you can download that. It's a 10 step email course. If you just go to venturingup.com, you'll see it. You can sign up for that. You'll get those emails and we'll walk you through step by step exactly how to do that for your business. It’s totally free. Yeah, so if you're interested, I would check that out.

Glynis Tao

Yeah. So I would recommend anyone listening with the product-based business to go check out James's course because it's a different way of looking at pricing. would say compared to typically how, you know, how I've always done it and how I was taught was looking at your margins, right? And just like making sure that you have enough margin, you're calculating at maybe a 50% gross margin. Yeah. But you actually discouraged costs plus pricing model, right? Talking about how businesses shouldn't only determine the price based only on their production costs alone, but to look more into the product value.

James Friedrich

Yes. Yeah, totally. And that's that's exactly

There's a saying out there and I've heard it before, but I'll kind of paraphrase it or steal it here is that like, nobody cares how much the product costs you to make. When we go buy something on sale at a store and we see it 50% off, we don't think of that, you know, that product's getting sold for the same as it costs them to make. Or if we know, a product costs thousands of dollars.

We don't, we don't know what the costs are and we don't as consumers, we don't actually care what the costs are. What we care about is how is that product providing value to us? And if we can take a value-based lens to our pricing, that means that we can effectively create a price for that product that's based on the value it creates in the marketplace. And if our costs are low, then we can compare to the value that we're creating, then we get that margin, and that margin can be higher than a 50% or a 60% margin.

But the reverse is also true, where if we have built a lot of cost into our product, but the marketplace doesn't value those costs that we built into our product, then our margins are going to be tight. The market doesn't value what we've done. And both, I've seen both those examples, but at least when you have the value-based pricing, you've done some of that methodology. Even if your costs, you're seeing, you know what, I've maybe overbuilt my product. You have some idea of what to take out of the product to reduce those costs and bring your value back in line.

I'll pop one more in there. The other one that I see as being really common is copycat pricing where you just have a product and you just look in the marketplace and you see everyone else is selling their similar product for $20. So guess what? That's going to be my price too, $20. This product is just worth $20. And that again, it's just, there's a whole bunch of bad things. The number one thing that's built into that is that you've made an assumption that everyone else has all done their homework and they've magically picked the perfect price for the product.

So you assume that everyone else has it all together, which in my experience, most people do not, right? You get to peek behind the curtain of a bunch of different companies. Most people, they're all kind of like struggling in the same way that you are. So don't assume people are smarter than you and do that research. And there may be an opportunity for a product, let's say a product priced at $20 for there to be a $30 product, a $40 product or a $50 product that's just been unexplored in the marketplace.

And I'll give just a little example of that. If we rewind maybe like 10, 11 years ago in the cooler market, you used to go to the Canadian Tire and you would buy a Coleman cooler and it would be, I don't know, 50 or 60 bucks or something like that. And then along came a brand named Yeti who took a totally different view on the cooler market.

And came out with coolers that were three, four, five times the price point of, of what a Coleman cooler would be at a store like Canadian Tire. But they backed it up with reasons like why that cooler was so great, you know, how long the ice would last in it, that you could stand on top and all these other features. And guess what? There's a huge market there. And now Yetis, you know, they opened this giant marketplace. Yeti’s well over a billion, I don't know what the actual revenue is, but it's, you know, a dominant player and opened up a brand new category of these high-end coolers. And guess what? There was a value, there's a place in the market for something like that, that nobody had been exploring. And that can be available to you too.

Glynis Tao

Yeah. So that's great. So that's another example of just using the concept of providing value or what you call that. Is that how you describe the value equation in your course about how you leverage this? Can explain how entrepreneurs can leverage this equation to be able to align the product price with customers' perceived value?

James Friedrich

Yeah, sure. So the equation that I've used, and I got this a number of years ago from engineering actually, is that we were looking at these large projects that were multi-million dollar projects. Some projects might be $5 million and one project might be $2 million. Well, how do you compare which one's better? These are just vastly different things. And there's an equation that I learned called the value equation, which is that we see value as being the performance of something divided by the cost. And we can think about this. I'll give you a couple of common examples of how that equation might apply.

The first one is Costco. So you go into Costco and people would say, is Costco good value? People, people generally say, yeah, Costco is great value, right? Why is Costco such a great value? Because when you, when you go in there, you get a lot of stuff or you get a big package, right? You're getting a lot of things and what you're paying for that is probably similar or less than what you might pay at a regular, a different store. So the value equation there is saying the performance in this case with Costco is I'm getting a lot of things for cost that is relatively the same. So that's great value. That's really, that's really good values. Okay. Well, there's one example and that seems like an obvious one. many people will be like, yeah, Costco is great value. 

Another way of thinking about the value equation is when we think of low cost or products that were lower price, we often call them value. It’s really good value. But when things get higher priced, our language changes to being like, that's really valuable. But it's the same thing, right? We're saying the same thing as like there's something behind that.

And another brand that is creating high value products, but we kind of use the word valuable more is Apple. So Apple doesn't have low priced products. Apple's products are typically the highest priced products in the categories that it competes in. But we don't see those products as being or crappy or anything like that. We see those products as being amazing and highly desirable. And again, because of the value equation, what Apple's done is they understand the performance that their customers are looking for.

They're looking for products that are beautiful, products that are really easy to use, products that give them some level of status when they're using them. Those are all the performance characteristics that Apple's building into their products.

And as such, they can charge a higher price for them, but the value equation still holds because those performance characteristics are high, but the cost, even though it's higher, is still justified based on those performance characteristics. So again, we see that as being really valuable. So using that value equation to your advantage is really about understanding what the performance that your product creates relative to the cost of your product itself. And that's kind of the heart and soul of value-based pricing.

Glynis Tao

And in your course, you actually teach people how to calculate that or how to come up with that equation.

James Friedrich

Totally. We go through a step-by-step process of being able to take that value equation, define the performance of your product, go out and objectively measure that performance as it relates to your cost and and be able to, you know, it's a step-by-step process to be able to get you into the target range for your pricing so that you have a confident kind of objective based approach to start your pricing from.

Glynis Tao

Okay. Awesome. Let's move on to customer targeting niche market focus. Sure. So in your course, you discuss the importance of targeting a specific niche.

How can entrepreneurs effectively identify and target a niche and what impact does this have on pricing?

James Friedrich

Yeah. So niche is niche or just a target market in some way is so important because if we end up targeting everyone, we kind of end up targeting no one. And the example that I'll give is, you know, just the difference between target markets is I'll say, let's imagine I have a few kids and I need to take my kids to the dentist and there's a regular dentist and there's a dentist that specializes in kids. So those two dentists, if I took my kids to them, those two dentists might do the exact same thing to check my kids' teeth and clean them and whatnot.

But the dentist that has said that they're specifically a kid's dentist is likely to be able to charge a lot more and also be able to speak to exactly what they're doing. As a parent who has a kid who needs to go to the dentist, I'm to be way more engaged and intrigued and open to looking at that dentist, the kid dentist, only because they have targeted the person that they're servicing. And when we can kind of niche down and target specifically who we're going after, it allows our language to be more precise. It allows the value propositions from the value equation to be more specific to the pain that that person might be feeling. And it just increases the likelihood that we're going to be successful with our product.

And now, Glynis, I know you do SEO work and some marketing work, and I'm sure that if a client came to you and knew some very specific target market information, it's going to be a lot easier for you to execute on the backend because you have an idea of who, okay, who are they going after and what keywords might be associated with that target and how can we write SEO copy for our website that's going to kind of like appeal to those keywords, but also to that target demographic. It just makes the entire process, everything you're doing become easier and more streamlined by having a tight target market.

Glynis Tao

You're absolutely right about that. Even in my work it all goes back to your ideal customer and who is it that you're trying to appeal to that you're trying to attract? Cause if you have no idea, you're not going to know what to say to them. So everything that you do from your pricing, your marketing, the language that you use, you know, what you say to them even like for me as a starting point, when it comes to keyword research, right? We need to know who's your audience.

James Friedrich

Exactly.

Glynis Tao

So that we could choose those right, the right keywords based on what it is that they're looking for.

James Friedrich

Yeah, exactly. And you know, I know for a lot of people starting out and I've had this fear myself is that sometimes we look at these target markets and we niche down to like a more precise target market and we can sometimes feel like, Ooh, geez, we're cutting out all this potential by going more niche. It means I'm not going to have as many opportunities to sell my product or services.

And the first thing that I want to say to this is you're not getting married to this person, right? Like, it's not like you target this person and that's who you can target. That's the only person you can ever target for the rest of your life. You know, you've now set this in stone. It's a target market that can change. You can add target markets. You can adjust and refine these things over time. So you don't have to feel locked into something that somehow a target market is going to limit your potential.

But what it is going to do is again, provide you that ability to kind of talk to someone specifically, and it's going to be far more likely that you'll get some traction going. And then yeah, you can adjust and refine along the way. And ultimately like, you know, learn and change who might be the right for you.

Glynis Tao

Yes, I totally agree with that. Let's just move on to pricing strategy and testing because in your course, you recommend assigning performance scores to product benefits. I mean, without getting into too much, but maybe you just sort of explain how companies can objectively measure these scores and how it helps in setting the right price. And maybe you could just touch briefly on this. We'll recommend the listener to go sign up for your course on how to do that, but maybe you could just sort of explain.

James Friedrich

Yeah, on the outset, what we want to be able to do is we can't ignore, if you have a product, we can't ignore that there are other products in the marketplace that even if they're not doing the exact same thing that your product is doing, there's probably competitive products around your product. And so we have to understand that those exist and that they have a price associated with them and that the marketplace can see that price. So in some ways, those competitive products are helping to define what the value is of your product.

So the Pricing for Profit methodology essentially looks at your product and the feature sets or the performance characteristics that you're creating and also compares those to the feature sets and performance characteristics of the competitive set to help you understand where your value lies.

Now, what's really interesting is if you've designed something into your product or the way that you're positioning yourself or bringing your product to market is unique in the marketplace, well, then there's no market value associated with that kind of those unique characteristics. And that allows you to set higher prices on those unique areas because there isn't a comparable thing in the marketplace that the consumer can judge against.

So, that's the essence of the process is to be able to kind of like use these objective measures and objective methodology to help set your pricing and then take that product to the market and start doing some testing with it and seeing how the actual product performs in the marketplace with the pricing that you set.

Glynis Tao

Amazing. How often should businesses revisit and test their pricing strategies and what key metrics should they be tracking during these tests?

James Friedrich

Yeah. So it depends a lot on the business and the type of product. I'm going to take the assumption here that the person listening to this podcast is going to be in a more fashion based business. So that means they're coming out with, you know, a seasonal product line. Maybe twice a year or four times a year. And for someone like that, you're not going to be able to change your pricing mid season. That's not going to work with your retail partners or with your consumers, because that's just the way the industry flows there.

But I would certainly be looking at your pricing every single season and the performance of your pricing of your products every season and how those metrics might impact a future season for you. If it's a product that is more of an evergreen product that's living and isn't seasonally based then I would be reviewing that product again every like, you know, three months or six months to see how the pricing is affecting it.

If you're in a direct to consumer channel, primarily direct to consumer, you're in a wonderful position because you don't have retail partners to worry about. And then you can actually change your products, your pricing of your products, kind of as you want. I wouldn't change them all the time, but you can certainly experiment with pricing a lot more. And especially if you're not a big company, it's unlikely that your consumers are really going to notice some price experimenting that's happening for you. And it gives you a lot of opportunity to test and refine pricing. The main thing is that you want to be able to leave a product at a price for long enough that you're seeing a sales result that follows it. If you're changing prices too quickly, you might not be getting accurate data.

So what I would recommend is that you take a period of time with a look at a baseline for a period of time with a product and look at how it's selling, make a price change, leave it at that price change for some period of time again, to be able to compare those two. Did we sell more? Did we sell less? Did we sell the same? And be able to refine just, you know, reviewing those two hopefully somewhat equal periods of time to create that objective difference.

The one thing I will mention on price comparison is that if you've increased the price of your product and your sales went down in terms of like the number of units, let's say it went down, that might not be a bad thing. If your margin is increasing, you might be making more margin on slightly less revenue than if you kind of sold more products for a smaller price. So just really look at the facts kind of behind your products there, because sometimes having a slightly lower revenue is a good thing. If your margin is increased, it makes your business simpler and there's less to do there.

Glynis Tao

Yeah, I know. Cause sometimes people think that they're focused on the number selling more of one thing, but are you pricing your product too low? Is that a sign of telling you that maybe you priced your products too low? If it's selling, you know, so much of this one thing, right? But are you actually making money off of it? Whereas if you increase your price of it, maybe you'd sell less, but you'd be making more.

James Friedrich

Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And I've seen that come true many times.

Glynis Tao

Yeah. I think people are sort of afraid of how to price their products, especially when they're first starting out. And I've encountered so many startups who are just sort of like, I'll just mark it up this much because, you know, I have to be competitive be aligned with what's out there in the market, but they're not pricing it for profit. I'm like, you're not going to survive if you're thinking of going in with the mindset of losing money from the beginning.

James Friedrich

Yeah. Your margin is so important there and the mindset you're talking about, the fear and the entrepreneurial fear of not pricing your products high enough. There's a psychological component to us as business owners and entrepreneurs where sometimes we feel our work isn't worth the price that the market might be willing to pay for it. It's almost more about us in that sense than it is about what the market thinks.

And that's the goal of the Pricing for Profit exercise is to kind of take yourself out of the equation and look at the objective information that's available to you to make those decisions. And you may be surprised yourself about what you find when you look at it that way.

Glynis Tao

And so the goal of Pricing for Profit, it says on your website, with a properly priced product, you'll realize an increase in revenue, improved cash flow and more profit.

James Friedrich

Exactly.

Glynis Tao

Yeah. So I mean, what other things would come out of pricing products properly, besides cash flow, maybe even customer retention. So I guess the question is how can a well priced product impact other areas of their business, such as cash flow and customer retention?

James Friedrich

Yeah, well, cash flow is directly tied to the product pricing and margin. And in most product businesses, your biggest expense is going to be your inventory. You're spending a lot of money to bring this inventory in. And then there's these physical products that are sitting there that can be turned into cash. And if you're not cycling that inventory over, that could be what causes the issue in your business not to succeed.

So cash is king in a product business, which is kind of the big impetus behind the Pricing for Profit is being able to properly price those products that you're maximizing your cash flow. Cause in the beginning, if you can get your products moving, your cash moving, things cycling through, that is an opportunity for you to grow your business. A business that's gaining momentum in that way, cycling through products, cycling through cash is one that in the marketplace, people are going to be seeing as something that's working, there's going to be momentum, excitement behind it. And it's just all of those things that come and help you ultimately sell more products and help your business to become more successful.

Glynis Tao

Before we wrap up, I just want to ask for entrepreneurs who are looking to prove both their pricing and profit margins. What is the key advice that you would offer based on your experience?

James Friedrich

Yeah. Well, niche and increase is kind of what I say in my head.

So niche in the sense of niche down your target, understand who you're going after. And when you've niched down your target market, there's an opportunity for you to increase your product price because you're going to understand how your product creates value for that target market. And there's going to be an opportunity for you to increase there.

I would say niche and increase are the things that kind of pop to mind.

Glynis Tao

Before we end off, mean, like, how are you going to use your experience that you gained from everything you've done so far and to now run Ambler?

James Friedrich

Yeah, well, I'm super excited. I mean, it's a full circle moment for me to be owning Ambler and ultimately my mission is to help as many entrepreneurs as possible as well as growing a successful business. And I feel so fortunate to have had all the experiences, good and bad, that I've had throughout my career, because even those times are really challenging and hard. Those are the times when you often learn the most, even though you didn't kind of feel that way, maybe at the moment. And all of that experience, I'm excited to kind of put it into practice with Ambler. And my goal is ultimately to be able to take that experience that I've had throughout my career and the experiences that I'm going to have with Ambler and be able to use those to help other people. And so that's my goal. I don't know exactly how that's all going to pan out or work yet, but that's the intention and I'm just really excited to do it.

Glynis Tao

Yeah. I mean, can you share with us some things that you're looking to do with Ambler?

James Friedrich

Yeah. Well, there's a lot of opportunities at the company. Jackie and Christian, who were the previous owners, they owned it for 15 years, did an amazing job of running and building this brand up. So my goal is to be able to just capitalize on the amazing work that they've done. And what I can see is that there's a geographic opportunity for Ambler in Eastern Canada, looking to increase our geographic presence there. There's a number of brand opportunities and some product opportunities with the company.

And so kind of exploring all those and above that, we do some amazing custom products and I'm really excited to dive into and grow that custom area of the business. So if anyone's listening to this and they're looking for small run custom headwear, come check us out at amblermountainworks.com. We have an awesome custom program and would love to help you out in making your custom hat dreams become a reality.

Glynis Tao

Amazing. And your products are made in Canada still, right?

James Friedrich

Well, everything Ambler does is either made in Canada or Fairtrade from Nepal. So it's just a super strong values based company, which aligns perfectly with me. And so, yeah, it's either Fair Trade Nepal or made in Canada. So it's awesome to be able to, you know, from a value standpoint, just work in personal alignment with those things. And I'm super excited about it.

Glynis Tao

I'm so excited for you, James, and just so happy to see how everything you've done has come together for you. And, just excited to see where this all goes.

James Friedrich

Yeah, thank you. I am too. And I appreciate being on the podcast, Glynis. I'm super appreciative of the time being able to talk to you and have this experience.

Glynis Tao

Amazing. And where could people find you if they want to get in touch with you?

James Friedrich

Yeah, for sure. So if you want to get in touch with me, you can check me out at venturingup.com. I'm also active on LinkedIn, LinkedIn James Friedrich. Friedrich is spelled fried and then rich. And check me out on LinkedIn, give me a follow, or you can also check out our products on Ambler at amblermw.com.

Glynis Tao

Amazing. And you can access James' free step-by-step email course, Pricing for Profit, through James' website, is venturingup.com. You'll be able to find it there. And I'll put a link in the description for this podcast right down below in the description area.

Thank you so much, James, for being here today and sharing your entrepreneurial experience, product and pricing expertise and insights with us today.

James Friedrich

Awesome. Thanks, Glynis. I appreciate it.